The Great Realignment: Guardiola's City Exit, Alonso's Chelsea & World Cup 2026 Fallout

This BBC Podcast is supported by ads outside the UK. Influences and content creators have been making headlines at the US Open, but how important are they to tennis? Find out by searching for more than a school wherever you get your BBC podcasts. Get more with BBC Podcasts wherever you listen. Be the first to listen to your favourite shows, like Evil Genius, Good Bad Billionaire and Your Dead To Me, with a subscription to BBC Podcasts Premium on Apple Podcasts. You can also enjoy a range of our podcasts ad-free with an Amazon Music subscription. Commentators view we are back for the new season talking about the football, our travels and the language we use to describe the beautiful game and back as well for the start of the new season, Mr. Ian Dennis and Mr. Alistair Bruce Ball. One of you is fully refreshed. You're the one I don't think has stopped work. Ah, for weeks and weeks. Well, no, John, I did so after the Open Championship, which was straight off the back of my return from the World Cup. I did get a couple of weeks in there, but you're right. The last week has been extremely busy learning, talking about commentary on a different sport, actually trying to learn commentary on the world of athletics. So, yeah, I've been in Birmingham doing the European Athletics Championships, which, as I've described to you, both offer has been a steep learning curve. I'm going to describe it as. Yeah, we should talk about that in a minute. But first of all, Ian, you are fully refreshed. Full of your fresh. Look at your beaming face that I can see down the line. Well, I'm feeling a little bit guilty, actually, because obviously, Ali has been extremely busy. A new return to work last week during the, during the Super Cup, didn't you in Salzburg? Okay. Whereas, since the World Cup, I've had, I've had done absolutely nothing. So, this is, this is my first commitment of my, of my new season. Very good. So, you'll be, you'll be, you'll be wearing to go that already, all, all prepped, all across it. Slightly apprehensive about past the commentators. I've never felt so undercooked ahead of a, ahead of a new season, then I have this particular time. I'm sure you'll hit the ground running. But, Ali, I mean, obviously, people listening to this will be, I, you would like to think, interested in radio commentary. So, how much of a stretch was it doing the athletics for the first time? Wasn't it? Yeah. At a, at a big event? Yeah, first time on edge, on so early this year, I went to a, a championships where we, you know, I was sitting in the stadium and commentated on a load of races, but they weren't for anyone to listen to other than me and others to give me tips. So, I had a classic Rob Noffman session. Actually, just before I flew out to the World Cup, I did an hour with, we've mentioned Rob on the podcast before, who is a, he's a brilliant coach, isn't he, to commentators and, and pundits and presenters, as well as being a brilliant broadcaster himself. But, Rob gave me an hour. I scribbled a load of notes down, which I then got out at the start of last week, ahead of the athletics and I think as with any new sport, it's just the only way you learn it and get better is by doing it. Eventually, you have to be dropped in the deep end and just do it. Couple of things that really struck me about the week doing it, though, were one, the instant recognition that I have of athletes in, say, football and golf is not there yet in athletics because I've not been immersed in the sport enough yet to. So, the sort of top level, maybe top 5, 10%, and the British athletes, you recognise them. But, when you're suddenly in a sort of 3,000 metre steeple chase, and there's not a Brit running and, I mean, you know, they are running in team colours, so that sort of helps you. But, what I was finding was quite often, and particularly in the shorter races, it's hard. You'd have to look down at a bit of paper just to get a name to remind yourself. And by the time you look up, hit, the actions happened, you know, it's gone. So, there's going to be a bit of work, you know, I'm just going to have to just plug in to the sport a lot more, which I'm going to enjoy doing because I love the sport. And the other thing that really struck me was, but this is the same with all of the commentary we do on any sport, is trying to find different ways to describe the same thing. You know, I mean, we have that in football, we have that in golf, we have it in everything, don't we? But, just trying to use different forms of words to describe. It is, I mean, it is one of the most basic sports of all, isn't it? Running, jumping and throwing, so just trying not to be too repetitive with it. I think that's the other thing. We should move on, shouldn't we? And I must say as well, I did enjoy what I heard of you at the open. It's slightly different for you at the open, as well, wasn't it? Presenting for three days and then hair-champions, one's in for the final round. He's swung in on the Sunday, and yeah, I went back to rank and file. And actually, the funny thing with that, John, your life at this is, normally open championship week. We arrive, don't we, on say the Monday or the Tuesday, have a good walk of the course, get our bearings. So, their golf courses we've been at before. And we always sort of rib hair-champion for not sort of not exploring the property. He tends to find a couple of spots he likes presenting from that are close to like ice cream vans and coffee stores. Coffee? Exactly. But I realise very quickly as the presenter, actually, that is the best thing to do. Then I went out on the golf course of the Sunday to commentate. And I came off a couple of greens, I was like, where do we go next? I can't like, because I'd not walk the course. I was wandering around a little bit lost. But it was, I tell you what, I mean, so you guys were just about to, where you were, getting ready to do the World Cup final. And we were heading towards the potential of a playoff in the open, you know, sort of crashing into the start of the World Cup final. And, you know, where the golf commentary was going to go and all that sort of thing. So, it, you know, from a work point of view, it was brilliant that Ryan Fox hold that part just to sort of, you know, tie it up, put a neat bow on it, and then we could get over to you guys. But actually, it was a brilliant finish to the open championship that, I mean, to the way he attacked that final hole, you know, took a big risk with the driver of the tee and, and birded it. And in no time at all, you know, he was so quick in the way he did it. And so unfussy, you know, one of the open walked off the green. Thanks very much. It was, it was brilliant. It was a brilliant open, actually. Yeah, that was the first open championship that I've not been at since the 1990 open at St. Andrews. I've been at every one in some capacity since. And I must say, it was a really surreal experience sitting with you, Ian, in the World Cup final stadium preparing for that, listening to the open. It really, it was, it was quite bizarre for me. But if you recall, I wasn't sitting with you for that long, because we'd had quite an arduous entrance into the MetLife stadium for what had actually been a rather dramatic 24 hours ahead of the World Cup final. So I'm not too sure if you know this, Ali. But the day before the World Cup final, I was actually told I wasn't doing it. What's because there was no space, there was only limited space. So there was a lot of forces at play that then got the spaces that we required. So that was, that was an interesting day before the World Cup final bearing in mind, I'd spent most of the morning prepping for it. Then thinking, well, there's no point prepping for it now. I'm not doing it. And then John had arrived in the first car nice and early, got him without any problems, say, got him without any problems. It was like getting into four knocks, because Donald Trump was coming. So the security was ramped right up. But then when we arrived, I was in the second car with Chris Sutton, Paul Robinson, and Lady Kelly. And at that point, the cue to get in the media entrance was horrendous. I would say you were looking at at least a three hour wait time to get into the stadium. But for some, it was, it took them four hours to get through that cue. Yeah. And again, we managed to circumnavigate that because we were the rights holders. We still had to go through a very stringent security check because of Donald Trump's presence. So I think by the time I actually got to the position, was it about an hour and a half? Before, yeah, kick off. Well, was it, was it, was it that close? Can I ask you, though? So, so that was, that was, as I say, the, the open championship wrapped up and we all race back to a house and watched it as a group. The, uh, the five-life golf team who stuck around. So it's sort of 15, 20 of us, sink to your commentary up with the pictures. It was, it was a terrible game. It was a great listen. Did, did you enjoy it as an occasion? Well, I did, because it was the world cup final. And I thought it still had a really good narrative. And also that it was won by a goal, which I always prefer. And I think I can probably name four worse or as bad World Cup finals. Got it, then. Which would be 1990. 94 was probably the worst in our time. 2010 wasn't very good. What was the other one? It was between 2014. 2014 wasn't great. Either was it? Yeah. Goats are scored. Those very similar. 2014 was very similar when Goats are scored. The, the goal to win it in that a time. I just thought the whole Argentina narrative was, was so interesting and house, how Spain caught with them. And I still think, I still think that England had, they managed to win that semi-final. I think England might have posed more problems to Spain than Argentina did. Yeah. The other amusing thing during the second half of the World Cup final is that there was a Spanish commentary team in front of Chris Sutton, who weren't sitting down. And he threw, and I'm going to say it distracted me for a while, because he threw some ice. One of the commentators to get them to sit down. And he took the exception to this yellow, I think they would say, in Spain being thrown at him. And he turned round and he was basically saying, I'll see you outside afterwards. And at one point, the guy stood up in front of our cup box and, and motioned as he was going to pull out our leads apart. No. He was, he was that irate. So it was probably a good job that Spain actually won the World Cup, because otherwise, things could have turned sour. But that was, that was quite amusing. But anyway, although the subject of that, that, yeah, we've, well, first of all, back to the script. This is interesting when John, you've just mentioned about, that was the first open that you'd missed. But we'll come back to that maybe ahead of the Premier League season. But Meredith from Wembley says that for a pub name suggestion, of course, unintended pub names if you're new to this podcast. But he says, I can't remember if you've had this before, but the correspondence from the summer, your coverage along with Johns, ABBs, and the rest of the crew was awesome. If there hasn't been a suggestion yet on TCV, a good pub name would be the commentary box. Have we had that before? We've had that before. I'm not sure if we've had that before. But that is, that is a very, very good suggestion, isn't it? And we will move on to later, because back for the new season, we will have some suggestions for the great glossary, a football commentary. We will have the first clash of the commentators, won't we have the new season? Your thoughts on favourite for that, John? Talking of Johns, we've had this correspondence from John and Lidham. Hearing the infectious enthusiasm of all three of you leaves me in no doubt. It is all of yours, dream job. I envy you so much, three O's in so. Experiencing it first hand and relaying it all towards in those magnificent arenas all over the world. I bet you have to pinch yourself sometimes. You've landed such a wonderful gig. John is the King, though, closely followed by ABB and Ian in no particular order. So John says John is the goat. Well, that's very kind, John. I appreciate that, Lidham, Lidham, Lidham, and Tans. But I mean, it was, it was a lot packed into that. You were away Ian. The longest of all of us, weren't you? Yeah, 52 days. I left on the 31st of May and I returned on the 21st of July, because I had to cover the England pre-camping West Palm and Florida. I mean, there are, there are worse locations to be sent to, I've got to, I've got to, yeah. It was such, as we knew it would be, because it would be played over such a huge tract of land that, you know, the experiences were so many and varied, weren't they? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And John is absolutely right there. I often think about this, particularly at the major tournament, because I think that the major events that we cover, you know, when we are abroad, whether they're World Cup's Olympics or, you know, the Masters goal for, you know, well, not even abroad, the Open Championship as well. I'm not sure how to not been in this job, how many of those I would have got to and got to see, you know, how committed I would have been as a sports fan to get myself to places like that. And, you know, I mean, you look at the commitment people have to put in this summer, to get over to the States and the, you know, the ticket prices and all of that. So we are, I always think that we are extremely lucky to be there and, you know, watch the sport we love and, you know, and, and get to work on it. So John is absolutely right there. And Jenny's written in, by the way, this, this is connected to, this is good, this connected to the World Cup. Dear TCV team, I write this note with a little tinge of embarrassment, but I also felt compelled to drop you a note. My husband, John and I had the pleasure of meeting John Murray and Paul Robinson in Atlanta during the World Cup. I introduced myself to you as you were recording your pre-show preview and you were kind enough to stop recording and say hello. You kindly gave us a shout out on your last pod, but I'm embarrassed as you rightly pointed out that I completely ignored Paul Robinson. I said to my husband as we walked away from the meeting, I think I might have just ignored a famous footballer there. And then I realised who it was. Anyway, please apologise to Paul. I think I was just star struck by meeting the inimitable John Murray, whose unmistakable voice was the thing that stopped me in my tracks. That's very good, Jenny. I love that. Yes, I did, because Jenny's email was forwarded on to me. So I have replied to Jenny and I have as I should really, I should have said this the first time around. Really, it was our fault for not introducing Paul to them. So Jenny, Jenny is in the clear. When you say it was our fault, you mean it was your fault? That's me, Gary. Gary Flint. Paul could have introduced himself. Hi, I'm Paul Robinson. He could have done that. I think if you don't get into the bus there, that's... Jenny was speaking to you. Jenny Polo didn't know who Gary was. All right, I'll put my hands up. I'll put my hands up. It's my fault. It's my fault only. I must mention as well a colleague from Mexican TV who I think I... Well, I did. I met at the World Cup draw in Washington before Christmas so we'd had a chat there. And then in the aftermath of the Mexico England match, I was in the media room there and he came over to me and he said, I've been looking for you. And we had a nice chat and he said, and I've got a gift for you. And he reached into his bag and he pulled out a Mexican wrestler's mask. And he said, this is for you. That sounds absolutely blown away by it. So I've got a Mexican, you know, those things that you've put over the head. Those Mexican, like they all wear. I've got one of those now. You just reminded me as well, sorry, of the week just gone in Birmingham and actually it connects you into your story and you're sort of almost dust up with the Spanish commentary team at the World Cup Final. We had a couple of Hungarian chaps come and take the Hungarian television next to us last week in Birmingham who, you know, I introduced myself to on the first morning, Tom Ash was the name of the guy who was sitting right next to me. A couple of lovely fellows. And he was quite amused to learn that it was my first go at athletics commentary. So then when I saw him on the second day, he said to me, you know, you've got this, you've got this, you've got this crack now, you know what you're doing. You're an athletics commentator now. And then at the end of the week, our last exchange last night was where he said, he said, if I see you next year in Beijing, you did a good job. If I don't, you didn't. And I said, I said, you're right. Hopefully I will be there for the World Athletics Championships. But also they were quite fun because they, the worst bit of their job in the morning, someone had to bring them on air and do the first sort of 10 minutes. Like each of us take turns to do the pod. And every day they would sit next to each other and they'd play rock paper scissors to see who would open up the show. And I would watch these two fellows. And Tom Ash who was sitting next to me on the right was much, much better at it than the other guy. He said he could read him. But every morning I watched, he won. And the other guy had to, had to present the show. But they were, they were, they were, they were, they were good fun, those two. That little tale, John's probably thinking he's got away with the, the Mexican wrestler's mask. But as soon as John was telling that story before you then told that one, Ali, I'm thinking the next time that you're recording this from home, you've got to wear the mask. I'm not sure whether that's a good idea. I'll wear my steps and you wear the mask. What did you bring back? Then I must be, uh, what did I bring? What did I bring back? I didn't bring back a great deal. Item of clothing. An empty wallet. I know I brought back an empty wallet. Also actually, that wasn't the only item of clothing I was given. All right. Because another colleague from Uzbekistan, who I'd also bizarrely, I'm met him in Buda. And he's called Abdul Vosid. Abdul Vosid. Bechtemirov. And, uh, and we happened to cross pass again. And similarly, he reached into his bag and said, um, here, I've got this for you. And it was a dupe, which are those little square hats that the, did you see them? The Uzbek supporters. It's like a traditional hat that you wear. And he gave me this little, it's a very odd thing. It's like flat, but you pull it out. It's square. And you sit it on the top of your head. So, so I've got a, I've got an Uzbek dupe as well from the World Cup. Excellent. If the powers that be are listening to this now, this is pure social media content. But during the mindset, I saw you were a lot wearing your steps and with your, uh, your partner in crime, Chris Sutton. Johnny, you've got to wear the, the wrestler's mask now and the dupe. The wrestler's mask and the dupe. Yeah, I know. Having just done the, the athletic actually, I'm, I'm not around for the first week, weekend of the football season, which is upon us. So, um, what have we got coming up, John, and where are you two going to be? Well, of course, we are on the cusp, the verge of the new football season. And yet again, as has always been the case, we will on five live and BBC sounds be broadcasting more Premier League football commentaries than anywhere else. So, five live is the place for the biggest football commentaries at three o'clock on a Saturday, the five 30 commentaries on a Saturday, the, the biggest games on Sundays as well, and many, many more. Also, and that's just the Premier League, of course, the all the other competitions as well. But it all gets underway on Friday night when we will have updates on Arsenal Coventry on five live into Premier League kickoff with Darren Fletcher. We will have updates on whole city Manchester United on Saturday lunchtime into five live sport with Mark Chapman, who will be back for the start of the new Premier League season from 12 o'clock on Saturday with all of your favourites. And then, I'm going to need a bit of help here from you two across our commentaries on the opening weekend of the Premier League. Ian, you are involved in the main three o'clock match, which is... Nottingham Forest versus Leeds United, which should be a cracking atmosphere at the city ground, I'll be with Chris Sutton from that at three. But like last season, that's the commentary in the usual goal service. But we've got an alternative offering at three. And Connor McNamara will be doing Ipswich Town back in the Premier League against Sunderland. That's on Sports Extra. Lucky boy. And John, I've just seen you've got, so you've got two games, John. You're 530 Saturday, Brentford against Tottenham, who've really made some additions to the squad this summer. Be really interesting to see how they start the season under Roberto Deserbi, actually. And then Sunday, I see 430. You're at St James's Park with Pat Nevin for Newcastle Liverpool. But I must mention before that, two o'clock, Manchester City Borough, Mathalie Barber and Paul Robinson doing that game and Brighton and Hove Albion, Ian, to give them their full title, which I know you like to do against Aston Villa on Sports Extra at two o'clock. So, yeah, so out of those games, John Brentford Tottenham, Newcastle Liverpool, what are you looking forward to? I think the team that are most looking forward to seeing this season, which I will do at some point over the course of the opening weeks, is Coventry City. I'm really looking forward to going there again, and to seeing this team and how they're coping in the Premier League, because it's been such a long time for them. And I think whenever you have a club that has had such a long spell out, and then they get back to the top division, that's always worth seeing, isn't it? But that Newcastle Liverpool game will be so emotional, won't it? Because obviously the day after the World Cup final was the sad news of the passing of Kevin Keegan and two of his former clubs, and the outpouring of emotion, particularly on time side, the amount of shirts and flowers and scarves that were laid down the reads outside St James's Park was quite astonishing, really, but not surprising, given the impact that he had there as both a player and as a manager. And the fact that it's Liverpool as the first game where the Newcastle supporters inside St James's Park will be able to pay their respect, so I think we'll be quite something to behold. I think I'll always remember where I was when I heard the news about Kevin Keegan's death, because it was, as you say, Ian, and I know it's the same for you too, the day after the World Cup final, and you know, it felt like all of that, that everything that had been involved in the World Cup, we'd done the final, and then it was the day to go home, and we had a few hours, and I was just about to go across into Manhattan from where we were in New Jersey, and I was walking out along the waterfront, I got the phone call to say that Kevin Keegan had died, and I knew that obviously we were aware of the fact that his health was not good, and probably the end wasn't far away. But it just felt really emotional to hear that news, because he was my first football hero, really, when I was growing up, because he was the England captain, and you know, he was such a personality, and then, of course, we had to go on air, didn't we? And just looking back on his career, which I do know very well, really, but to dangle back into it, what an incredible life in football he had. I think anyone who had any dealings with Kevin Keegan will have been really affected by him and the news, because he was just so infectious, wasn't he? He was, yeah, he was full of enthusiasm. On the day after I told a story on Five Lever, I won't go into it now about the day that we went to Lapland with him, we think it was about 400 deprived kids from time-side, and how magically he was with all of those school children, when he was still the Newcastle United Manager. In fact, that was probably weeks before he then resigned in the January of that had been 97, but my last dealings with him was when Mike Ingham was stepping down, and what I'd done, Mike, I think, had worked under 11 different England managers, and seven of them were still around. And obviously, I reached out to Kevin and said, could you sign this shirt, because I was going around, getting them all to sign an England shirt, to give it to Mike as a fair well-gift, and I contacted Kevin because he was coming up to the northeast to do a dinner, and so we arranged to meet at Close House, and I took my boy with me, who at the time would have been, I think, probably about eight or nine, and Kevin said, you all meet at this time. And then my son said, Dad, I think he's just left, so I contacted Kevin, and I said, I'm in reception. Anyway, to get into Close House, you arrived through one single lane track, and you exit through another single lane track, so we arranged to meet at the top of the exit, before he went off to the dinner. He signed the shirt, posed for a photo, signed an autograph for my son as well, and he made Harvey at that time just feel like he was all about the boy. He's got this ability to make people feel so special, and then he disappeared, and then I sent him a message when I'd heard that he'd got, you know, got the cancer. But that, I think that just summed him up. Yeah, no, well said in. Funny that, you know, his impact was such, I mean, I'm the same as you too. He just played such a massive part in me getting into the game of football, just at the time I was getting into football as you said, and he was just such a... So much charisma, that's what I love about, you know, the greatest sportsman and women. Charisma is such a big part of it, and he had oodles of that, and then I only came across him regularly later on when he was Manchester City manager, and I did a beat as a football reporter in Manchester. I'd go and interview him, you know, once a week in the build-up to whatever game it was, and he was a brilliant to deal with as you've both been describing. But also at times, you know, it was great for me because you'd always come back with a line, something entertaining, something newsworthy, and he was too honest for his own good at times, wasn't he? Sometimes you think you will ask this question, loads of people wouldn't give an answer to it, but he will, and you'd almost think, well, you know, stop, stop, stop a second, you know, but that wasn't him at all, was it? And actually, do you know, his impact on, I think, particularly people of our generation, funny enough, again, at the athletics this week, I got into conversation with Steve Kram about Kevin Keegan, and Steve, Steve, you know, I don't think knock'd about with him regularly, but obviously too, you know, sporting superstars, you know, from the northeast, obviously, you know, spent time at Kevin Keegan. You're right, John, and it's just so sad. It really, really hit me. Yeah, like you, John, I was just really, you know, for a day or so, and still now, when you think about it, just really sad, just so sad he's gone. So there will be, I mean, the tributes will be something else, I'm sure, they will, absolutely, on Sunday. And it is funny, isn't it? The way that things work, that it has so happened, that Newcastle and Liverpool play each other. And I've always felt that there is a bit of a bond between Newcastle and Liverpool, there are lots and lots of similarities between the two cities, really. And for Kevin Keegan to have managed and had such a link and played for both of them, and then for them to play on this first Sunday, that is going to be quite an event. So, so that is 4.30 on Sunday. Influencers and content creators have been making headlines at the US Open, but how important are they to tennis? Find out by searching for more than a score wherever you get your BBC podcasts. Get more with BBC Podcasts wherever you listen. Be the first to listen to your favourite shows, like Evil Genius, Good Bad Billionaire and Your Dead To Me, with a subscription to BBC Podcasts Premium on Apple Podcasts. You can also enjoy a range of our podcasts, Add Free, with an Amazon Music subscription. On BBC Sounds. Fast, straight back down the ground, this girl. A ball-by-ball coverage of the biggest competitions on the domestic and international circuits. It's a ball-frogant and it's the huge one. You are too sparse, settle down for Sunday. Cricket on five-life sport. Oh, living in every ball, really. Listen on BBC Sounds. The commentators view on the football daily, with Alistair Bruce Ball, John Murray, and Ian Dennis. With the new Premier League season coming up, and of course, as well, we should mention Monday Night Club every Monday. So, Fullham Chelsea, there'll be updates on Fullham Chelsea, and so, that's on five-life on Monday night. What is it that is most capturing your imagination about the season of Premier League commentary that lies ahead? Would you say you, too? Oh, it's a good question. That is a good question. It's a good question. After watching the community's shield, I think Arsenal have already laid down a marker. I don't... I remember the time when... Erling Harland, I think he made his debut in the community's shield. It was at the King Power and Lester, and people were quick to draw jump to conclusions, because he'd made nine touches or something like that. Oh, he could struggle in the Premier League, and he soon put that to bed. And Manchester City did look off. Yes, he had caught the eye, hadn't he? He did not, but he had a match. Yeah, other than Harland. Yeah, but Manchester City, on the evidence of the 90 minutes at Cardiff, I thought they didn't look quite up to speed, but that's maybe not surprising, given that players are still coming back from the World Cup and might not have got the minutes in from pre-season. But Arsenal did look particularly sharp. I thought Erdogard was outstanding. For City, to have lost Pep Guardiola would have been, you know, impactful enough, but to have now lost Roderie, as well as Puege, or Silver, and John Stonnes, Nathan Ackay, you know, all of that experience. I mean, that is a massive change for City. And okay, you know, we'll have to see what happens between now and the end of the Mercando or the transfer window. That is a significant change, isn't it, for City? Yeah, and to your point, Ian, I thought the same thing. Pat Nevin summed it up very succinctly after the game, just, you know, Manchester City are a team in transition, huge transition. All those names you mentioned, John, and Arsenal just very much aren't. Are they, they've made some good additions, but they look, you know, exactly what they are, a team that know each other extremely well. And I think they're going to start the season well, so it's going to be who can keep, it looks like it's going to be, who can keep pace with them. You could also argue that Liverpool will be in transition this season, as well, given a new manager in Andoni Iriola. There's no, there's no Mo Salah. So potentially I'm thinking could Manchester United be, look to take advantage of that and be the closest rivals to Arsenal, given the impact that Michael Carrick had at the end of last season? I think for me, the thing that I'm most looking forward to is exactly that, Ian, to see which one of those teams is going to be able to make a fast start, when there's been so much change at so many different clubs. Yeah, yeah. And there is always only so much you can read into pre-season, isn't there? I mean, you know, you look at some of the results, and Liverpool have been letting lead slip. And well, Pedro's been scoring lots of goals for Chelsea and whatever, but when it actually starts for real, loads of that does go out of the window. I think the community shield slightly different, because I think that did tell a bit of a story about where those two clubs are. But you can be fooled, I think, by quite a lot of the pre-season football. The real thing is very different, isn't it? Yeah, I honestly, I know why people go to those matches and they're played all over the world now, and bring in the local audience who can see these players in the flesh, and maybe don't have another opportunity, but at the same time, you know, they are paying money to watch football that is totally and utterly meaningless. And, you know, he was ever going to remember the significance of what happens in those matches. And we actually had a question, I put out a punt on social media asking for some questions, correspondence, etc. And Roberto Hollis asked us the question, who is the player you're looking for to seeing the most in the Premier League that we saw at the World Cup? Well, that's a good question. What would your answer be? Well, it would have been, if the deal had gone through, when there was talk of Venetius Jr. appearing in the Premier League, potentially it asked of, that would have been superb. Wouldn't it, in terms of a sort of global superstar, and what he brings to any game and any football commentary? But obviously, that doesn't count now. I think my answer to that would be Morgan Rogers. Oh, okay. And even though that's not very exotic in terms of who I saw at the World Cup, I wanted to see more of him at the World Cup. And now having made that, I thought that was a really surprising move to go from Aston-Vellate to Chelsea. But I think the Shabby Alonzo Chelsea is another thing that I'm really looking forward to seeing this season. Because his by-a-leaver cousin team was so exciting and obviously things didn't work out for him at Real Madrid. But that leather cousin team really had something about it. And at that time, he was probably the hottest property, wasn't he, in European coaching. And now he's ended up at Chelsea, where there is a, there is a schism there. We've all been there. You know, things are not right at Chelsea Football Club. There are a lot of forces pulling in different directions. And how Shabby Alonzo is going to be able to bring that all together, I think we'll be, we'll be very, very interesting. But he's got a, he's got a super player there in Morgan Rogers. So I think he's the one I would pick out. My answer would be Ayub Wadi of Morocco, who's close to joining Manchester City. So he's only 18 years of age. But he's this energetic midfielder with the, that the mop of hair, the bushy hair, not as bushy and floppy as Cucko Rea, but it's not far off. And he's, I thought he was the standout player for, for Morocco. When I saw him at the MetLife Stadium very, very early on in the tournament against Brazil. So he, and he's only 18 as well. So he's only going to get better. He's got obviously huge boots to fill, if he's going to take the place of, of Roderie. But if he can slot alongside Anderson in that midfielder for Manchester City, then I think they have a, a real gem of a player. And I think he would be an excellent addition to the Premier League. Roberto's question, by the way, actually takes us very nicely into the first game of Clash of the commentators this season. If you two are ready for that. So this, this is the return of our famous head-to-head Clash of the commentators. Ian is the reigning champion, despite the justice for John campaign. Ian, Ian actually established a massive lead last season, really good, strong form throughout the season. John came back hard, but couldn't get it over the line in the end. So apparently I won series one of that. I don't remember that. Ian won series two, so, John. I've got a feeling. I've made a strong start both years and then, and then had a very bad spell. Okay, okay. Look, here's how it works. If you've not listened to the podcast before, if you can't remember, two of us take turns to answer a question and give us many correct answers as we can in 30 seconds. So when the first player plays, the other person obviously has to take their headphones off, so they can't listen to the answers. Who is going to go first today? This could be tricky, because we are both in BBC Studios, aren't we, Ian? Yeah, and also I've just noticed that I've got two percent on my phone. Oh, so if I go out, nobody's going to be able to call me to get me get back in. I'll just take that phone, I've got a tone. Out of, I'm going to go out of the room. Okay, all right, so defending champion. I think this is only right, actually, Ian should open up the new season. So this is, this is played and simple, Ian. John could have given me a guard of honor before he left, couldn't he? All we want from you today is any of the top 20 transfers money-wise this summer, and this is not just in the Premier League, this is in World Football. We're using data from the transfers website, transfer marks. So you've got to name any of the top 20 highest money moves from this summer so far. Your time starts now. Okay, Gamer Aish, Ferran Torres, Anthony Gordon. All right, I said I was undercooked. I can't think. No. Okay, do you know what though? Now in John's travails with this sometimes, that might be enough. Those, those, those three are correct. I can tell you that because John, John can't hear us right now. I'm not sure that's enough, three. As I said to you at the start, I have completely switched off. Yeah, me too. I've been, I've been away in Spain. I've been speaking Spanish. I've been enjoying tapas and everything else, so yeah. Now I, I got the message this morning that I was hosting this and not playing, and I thought I'm delighted about that because I'm exactly the same. I've been in golf and athletics and football has been like the furthest thing from my mind. So I, I think I would have been, I think I would have been very, very, very similar there. That is good timing. That is good timing. John is back. Right. John. Hello. Good timing that. Perfect. Perfect. All wrapped up. Done and dusted defending champion has unleashed his opening salvo in this season's clash of the commentators. So let's, sounds ominous. So let's see how you go on this. All we need today, any of the top 20 transfers money-wise this summer. Okay, not, this is not just brownie. If you want me to leave now. My time starts now. Morgan Rogers, Elliott Anderson. Um, uh, Christos Solis. Um, trying to think it was. It's been signed by Manchester United, Andres Santos. Or, uh, Austin. Oh, a Manzambi. Um, Chelsea also. Chelsea signed. Oh, I think that's a draw. I, I think that's a draw. I think that's, I think that's three all. So Denno only got three. Denno got four. Yeah, but oh, no, no, sorry, Johnny Wright Manza. I didn't see Manzambi's there. John, you've won. You have won. Hey, you've won. You've won the first game of the season. I didn't, that's a great shout, Manzambi. So Denno, you said, Anthony Gordon. Uh, who else did you say? Rash, uh, I said, uh, Anthony Gordon. And Ferran Torres, who all featured on the list. John, you nailed the top two on the list in terms of biggest money straight away with Morgan Rogers and Elliott Anderson. Yeah. And then, I should have got those. Yeah. And then you had your, uh, your manzambi. And Andre Santos sneaks in there. That's what you're on the list. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, sit 17. When I said that, I thought, I wonder if you would do that list. So look, I'll rattle through them very quickly for you. Full list, uh, Morgan Rogers, Elliott Anderson. Yandia Manday, uh, Sandro Tanali, Mateusz Fernandez, who's gone to Tottenham. Bruno Gimmarish, who he and said, Gonzalo Ramos, uh, who's gone from PSG to Milan. Yeah, Anthony Gordon, uh, Crescensio Somerville, uh, Jeremy Jacquet, Maxon Slequies, now at Chelsea. Yand Powell Van Hecken, now at Tottenham. Manzambi Vuskevich, Luke of Vuskevich. These are hard. Rasmus Hoyland, Marco Polestra, uh, who's another one who's joined Chelsea. Andres Santos at number 17. Mark Kukareya, who you've mentioned in the pod today, he and who's, who's made the move to Roe Madrid. Ferran Torres was 19th. It's not in there at 19th, the Mason Greenwood. 20th. Well played, Chaps. Very good. I think that illustrates how rusty we are. We say it does. It does. It's a bit of work to be done this week before that, uh, start the season. Where's the win just to be off, nice to be off the mark. Very good. Right at the start. Yeah, very good. But as I said, you know what happened last season and the season before. So I'm not counting any chickens. So that is it. That's, uh, that is the opening clash of the commentators. So you'll be on next week. I presume, um, and now briefly we haven't got much time left. Um, a little bit of great glossary of football commentary. And this is where, uh, we're building actually what is now quite the collection of commentary terms and phrases. We have football exclusive terms in division one. Things like cultured left foot, sweeper keeper, and draft excluder. And then we have division two for terms used in football commentary, but also used in other sports. For example, corridor over in certain, the hospital pass and good touch for a big man. You, I'm sure if you haven't heard it before, we'll get the idea. Uh, and actually the full glossary is in what we call the episode description on BBC Sounds. So, um, you can have a scroll down there and have a look at the whole thing. Anyway, James in Ipswich writes in. Hello, TCV team. Looking forward to the return of the new football season. It struck me that you haven't covered the term full house on the great glossary of football commentary, used in football to describe a stadium that is full to capacity. Yeah. Um, but other sports. I mean, you could have a full house in rugby. Would you say the cricket match, John, if, if lords was packed in the rafters? Yeah, you were. Yeah, it's a full house. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that sounds very much. The division solid. To do it. Solid. The one I like, John, the next one, this is something you spotted and actually posted on our little WhatsApp group. A term I'd never, never heard before, well worth discussing this. Albi Collier, a Barton town F.C. It's called four goals in their FA Cup win in the extra preliminary round. And it was described by the official FA Cup social media account as a poker. Um, so, and I, you know, when you, I never heard that. And I, I don't play poker. So I don't, I, you know, I know terms like flashback. I also thought poker was five, five cards, five cards. Yeah. So I can't, I'm not quite sure. I mean, it says, it says here that apparently the phrase poker goals comes from Spain. We're a stand of four of a kind in a card game. It's called a poker hand symbolizing four of the same element. But I've, I don't know about you guys. I've never heard that before. I saw that. I've mentioned it to a few, um, friends. And one or two have said that, yes, they had heard that. Mm-hmm. Poker for, for four goals. The first person I saw who scored four goals in a match was Malcolm Posquet of Carlisle. So for you, it should be a pocket. I remember at the time, I remember at the time being tremendously excited that I'd seen a player score four goals. Yeah. Can you think of? Have we ever done this? And we might have even done this in a clash with the common days. But if you were thinking of famous four goal hall, so specifically four goals, like Albie Collier scored, one that comes to mind for me is Archevin did it? Didn't he for Arsenal against Liverpool? I was there. You were there for that way, yeah. Yeah, come on, take it on that one. Yeah, you're right, yeah. Did Col Parma do it? Riz did he do it for recently? Yes, he did. Was that against Wolves? I think you're right. It's time for Bridge, didn't he? Didn't Julio Baptiste? Yes. Also scored four in a lead cup tie at Anfield. I think you're right, Johnny. For Arsenal. Yeah. Was that the, I think that might have been the five, five? Was it? Yeah. Anyway, there's something in mind that this was the first time that that had been done since Archevin. Yeah. I've got a feeling as well that F and a CoCo scored four for Norwich, a goodest part against Everton because Chris Sutton claims he set all four up and doesn't really get the credit for it. I've got a childhood memory of Ian Rush scoring five goals against David Pleats, Lutentown in 1983, and on the same day, Tony Woodcock scored five goals for Arsenal against Aston Villa. Wow. For Haley. I did. That fear glee rings a bell. But that's very well remembered that. Yeah. I commentate on Jermaine DeFoe scoring five when taught to be Wigga 9-1 at White Heart Lane. Who scored famously? I think a hat trick of hat tricks. I think nine goals in a match. And the nail that I want to say is Ted McDougall. Correct. Correct. Stand at the Vitality Stadium is named after him and he scored those goals in an FA Cup tie and I want to say against Margate. But I'm plucking hat for it. I mean, that could be absolutely nonsense that. But you're right. I think you're right. We've got another. This is not for the glossary. This again came from the punt that I put out on social media. This is from SJT, who says, can we finally put the second season syndrome to bed? And he must be a sundall and fan because he's referring to the sundall. So obviously a lot of people are talking about second season syndrome. But he very definitely does not want second season syndrome being put in the glossary. But if we did put it in the glossary, it would be in division two, wouldn't it? I guess. Guess so. But I'm not really heard it talked about in other sports, second seat. That does feel quite footballed. That might be one where we leave that for the list list at the side. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Just looked up, Ted McDougall, in an FA Cup tie for AFC Bournemouth in November 1971, he scored nine goals in an 11-0 win against Margate. Yes. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no UK or you can send us a message or a voice note on WhatsApp to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 0 8,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000 to 08,000