Tactical Crucible: Rest Defense Fractures and the End of Premier League Grace Periods

Hello and welcome to the TFO Football Podcast. I'm Joe Devine and today I'm delighted to be joined by renowned author, John McKenzie. Hello. All right, how's it going? Yeah, I'm now an author now that my book's out. Have you sold all your books out? Yeah. I think so, yeah. Yeah. Oh, they're all gone. Yeah. So no need to promote them anymore. Someone told me that a book was already available on, like, resale on Amazon. Only sold. Only went on sale like a few days ago. Tom Harris is here as well. You're right. All right. Oh, voice white. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You had a fun show, didn't you? I had a great show. Yeah. What I meant by that was I thought you were good on today's show. Okay. I had fun as well. I didn't mean to determine what your experience with the show was. But you had a fun show, didn't you? Yeah. Apart from that voice break just then. Yeah, apart from that. That also we've got Kaya Kaya here. Hey, all right, buddy. How's it going? I'm okay. I feel like we played a drinking game in the show and I'm it's taking its toll all the hydration. Yeah. I'm like, I must have enjoyed this making Steve's life difficult by longing out the show. I am sailing close to the wind right now. Kaya needs the toilet is what he's saying. Now, just to be clear, for everyone at home, we drank only water. Okay. We drank only water and we did it in the second half of the show anytime that John and then anyone else mentioned rest defense, which is why Kaya needs the toilet. So desperately. Jesus. There we go. Okay. Plus Steve Hanky's here. Gallimera. Oh, your voice had a little break as well, though. Yeah. There you go. I must be something to do. It's the first thing Greek. Why am I speaking Greek? Oh, sorry. Anyway, what did we talk about on today's show? Well, we start looking at an incredible opening Premier League weekend with Whole City's fantastic and funny, two-nil victory over Manchester United. Are there any tigers in the Bible? We just guess that it's in the TFO Theology podcast. We move on to a humbling start for the heavily funded Roberto DeZerby Revolution at Tottenham. They lost three nil to Brentford. Of course, do you have a diary? We discover who on the podcast notes down their daily thoughts. And what is in pickle? We ask back questions as well. I don't know. I think you use that as a really loose segway. It was a loose segway between the pickle bit and the diaries bit. You're right. We also play a rondo. That was a very exciting rondo. We've had an expert here for today's rondo. I'll give you three guesses as to who it was. And yes, you were correct. It was Tom Harris now. After the rondo, we head to time side where there were two coaching debuts as Matthias Yisler and Donnie Eureola oversaw Newcastle's draw with Liverpool. Manchester City nearly fell at the first hurdle, also, didn't they? But managed to turn it around against Marco Rose's Bournemouth. We talk about that near the end of the show. And then we end with the Champions Right Steve Arsenal and their opening day victory over Coventry City, which was all thanks to Christoph Solis and Arteta's wet brain master plan. We all knew all along that Solis was the one. How about that? Anyway, that was the whole show, I think. Did I miss anything Steve? No, no show. Well, I'd like to say that we're back to our full schedule from this week, so because now don't worry, Kai, soon you'll get to go to the toilet. Just imagine a waterfall. Yeah, he's holding onto the desk. He really is holding onto the desk. We should see his leg going underneath the table as well. It's a bad thing to see. Anyway, not to worry. We're back to our full schedule from this week. Kaira, what remind me of what our full schedule is? Well, our schedule, John, is as far as we release podcasts usually on a Tuesday morning. Now, that's the second of the week, because the first of the day, there he goes, guys, it's the running out of the room. The first of the week, we do a live show on a Sunday. Now, boys, you do have to close the doors to the studio. There it is. Now, we do a live show on Sundays, John. You know that because you're part, I'll just start that bit again because all the doors were closing. Okay, Kaira's lost one of the pictures. He's here. He's here on the BIRC camp. You can see in the background of Kaira's shot here for the people watching the video that he was so urgently trying to escape the room that he's smashed into the back wall. He's upset the picture of Henri and BIRC camp there. What was I saying? Oh, yes, I was saying the full schedule of our show. We do a live show on Sundays, usually after the 4.30 pm game, UK time. So around 6.30, something like that. We'll be doing that this week after, I think it's Manchester United, Ipswich on Sunday. You'll be there for that one, John, as will Kaira. We have a podcast that releases on a Tuesday morning to capture all of the other stuff that happens at the Premier League weekend. Then there's a show on a Thursday pm, which is usually either about the European football that happened the midweek football we catch up on the Monday night Premier League. Or we talk about some deeper dive topics. And on Saturday, of course, there's a ring for analysis audio only episode. They're already back. We've published two of those so far. I should say one of them is a little, the introduction to John's book. So if you're interested in John's book and you haven't bought it yet, give that episode a listen. You won't find it on YouTube. It's only on the RSS feed. So wherever you find your audio podcast, Spotify, Apple podcasts, that sort of thing. And that's the that's the full schedule. So I hope you can join us through as many of those episodes as possible. And I hope you enjoy today's episode, which will begin now. Was it one of the greatest and weirdest opening weekends of the Premier League ever? Well, right, Steve, it was chock a block full of shocks and upsets. Here's what happened. We had wins for two of the three promoted sides, losses for Man United and Spurs. They were pretty funny. Narrow escapes for Liverpool and Manchester City from potentially troubling defeats also hugely entertaining game between Brighton and Aston Villa that we'll talk about more on Thursday's podcast this week for any Brighton and Aston Villa fans along with Chelsea's game against Fulham, which is happening tonight as I speak. So where else to begin though, other than with whole city too. Oh, Manchester United, Neil. Now the Paddy McNair Derby, as is otherwise known. Tom Huddleston Derby as well. The Tom Huddleston Derby, any other takers for Paul McShane. The Paul McShane Derby. Harry McWire. Harry McWire Derby. Of course, he's actually playing in the game. Yeah. Any others? No. No. The devils and tigers have devils and tigers ever fought each other in any kind of fictional landscape of... I can't think of any. If there are any tigers in the Bible. Cross, mythos, don't they? Good question. Are their tigers in the Bible? John, I feel that you would know that as our resident theologian? Do you know what? I don't know if they're... Oh, I mean, the Bible is written in the ancient Near East where I guess there wasn't many... Yeah. Are there any tigers in the Bible? No. Tigers are absent from the Bible. It reminds me of that story of the Pope who wanted a picture of a rhino. So someone just drew one for him having never seen a rhino and it doesn't look much like a rhino. Yeah, old paintings of animals. I can't remember. I remember watching a documentary about this and learning about the specific name of the terminology. But before painters learn to do a specific thing with shaping, all paintings of dogs look insane. If you see paintings of dogs from like before 1600, you just think, what were they looking at? Like, how did they not know how to paint? Exactly, the same as their version of lions. It's crazy. That was perspective and that was one of the things that came during the Renaissance. Right. Perspective came during the Renaissance. They were so far away they couldn't see them very well. That's it. You know, I've always said they had no perspective during the Dark Ages. Or we don't say Dark Ages anymore. That's bad. You just say Dark Ages. No, in the nose of Woke. That's Woke got rid of the Dark Ages. No, I can't believe Woke has got rid of the Dark Ages. No one told me what do we call it the Middle Ages? No, you just sort of talk about the sort of period post the Western Roman Empire. You just do a bit more detail. Doesn't quite hold off the tongue in the same way, does it? There was still stuff just less of a written record. Woke got rid of the Dark Ages, guys. What a surprise. Anyway. Cut that extra laugh Thursday. Well, well, there we go. Anyway, that was that's the Paddy McNair Darby. Manchester United of course struggled to create chances against a team that conceded 61 goals in the championship last season. That's pretty funny in and of itself. I'll earn a 2-0 lead through two set pieces, leaving us all questioning three things. A, a man United worse than we thought. B, a whole better than we thought. And C, were there any trains back to Manchester that weren't cancelled? I don't know. You may not have seen that bit, John. I just didn't watch it. One of the largest cheers of the day was the stadium announcer in Hull, who incidentally is the loudest person I've ever heard. I mean, they've got that turned up to 11. He said midway through the second half when Man United were already 2-0 down. He sort of said with a degree of glee that two of the trains to Manchester, back to Manchester from Hull have been cancelled and the whole stadium erupted. Anyway, I felt very sorry for them, but I didn't feel sorry for Hull because they were I thought they were very good on the day, John. They came with a targeted game plan, didn't they? And it worked to a tee. Yeah, I think it's important for us to give flowers to Sergei. You're a cure of it, the whole manager and his coaching stuff because I think they came along with ideas. And yeah, maybe the big picture question that I had at the end of watching this game was, is this going to be an issue for Manchester United? We talked a lot at the end of last season about the way that Carrick wanted to generate chances. We talked a lot about how they looked to be quite central and create these central progression moments. But also if teams overload in the middle, then they sort of then try and exploit in the wide areas. And I thought Hull came with some pretty good ideas out of possession to stop those things from happening. So they played a back five, which means that you do have extra coverage in the wide area. So you're not going to get caught out if that happens. But they also played with this block of four in midfield who are very good, I thought, making sure the passes through the middle weren't going through. And they weren't passive as well. So what we actually saw quite a lot was the outside players in that four stepping out quite aggressively onto the Manchester United's back line when they were possessing the ball and trying to find those routes through when they did that. But again, because you have a back five, it gives you a bit of flexibility with what you can do without collapsing your back your back line structure completely. So we saw the outside centre backs being aggressive and covering the space that was opened out by one of those players further up the field stepping forward as well. So just a bit of everything like thinking about how a Manchester United going to try and generate in possession upside. What can we do to make it harder for them to do that? And then obviously set pieces allowed them to get the goals. And one other thing I think maybe worth noticing is it was pretty clear to me as well that whole were targeting the space behind Patrick Dorgu when Manchester United were pressing in there in their 424 shape. You know, it's the sort of 442 where the wingers can often go quite aggressive and high. They were overloading on that side and then they always had that escape and they would either try and play it over Dorgu's head into the fallback, but they also had, you know, McBerney dropping in the wide area overloading there so they could just play into the channel and they were finding routes through through there as well. So nothing completely groundbreaking but just lots of little ideas where it's like we thought about the way that Manchester United set up last season. Here's ways that we think we'll make it harder for them to deal with with with with that. And yeah, I guess for me the question is what kind of solutions now is carrot going to find because the Premier League is just so unforgiving when it comes to tactical approaches because you get six months grace and then everyone knows how you play. Their analysts will have spent all summer looking at the way that Manchester United played to prepare for this game and they and they found these little solutions and it just sort of put the game more into Holes Favour. So yeah, that's the big question I guess I have with Manchester United going forward. That will be the interesting thing for United season, weren't it, Kaya? Because you know, we've talked a lot previously on the podcast about managers being sort of found out the second season carrot card and incredible run in the second half of the Premier League with Manchester United, but you know, unlike most of the other big teams that didn't perform that well this weekend, Man United just didn't look like scoring once in the game. They really struggled to create chances, isn't it? Yeah, they have a big problem when they're expected to be protagonist in game. So this is the most possession they've had in any game since, do you want to guess? Anyone want to guess? Oh, yeah. 1934, 2013. Since the last 2-0-2, was it 2-1 to Grinsby Town in the caribou cut right? That was Amarim. We weren't quite big with our guesses, Jair. I think most of the Premier League games are 2023. So they've had an issue where they're expected to dominate the ball. That's been kind of a thing on the carrot for his entire 10-year in charge temporarily and now permanently. He's only been in charge for one year. It's still true, just to be clear. Not 10-year. I just wanted to be, I didn't want anyone to become confused at that point. Thank you. Thank you. Correct. What was the record? So carrots, good vibes under Michael Carrick. We kind of built by victories against big teams. So United, be city, they'd be Arsenal, they'd be Chelsea, and they'd be Liverpool last season. In all those games, they had considerably less possession. Then the opposition, they could kind of hit teams on the counter attack, but that wasn't just the case in games against bigger teams where you'd expect them to get results. So there were plenty of games, Brentford, Bournemouth, Sunderland, Forest, Brighton, all had more possession than Man United. Are you going to Carrick? Exactly. Well, I don't know quite that far, if I believe in that far yet, but you wouldn't call Man Toe, two people's names as part of it. I would generally, just not quite with this instance, just because I think maybe you need to give them a bit of time to try and find solutions to it. But the games where United had more possession last season, generally, they were playing against teams who were down to 10 men. Often, when they're expected to control games or dominate games, they kind of struggle to create chances. And that's kind of, I guess, what the whole midfield reinforcement has been about, like signings like Carlos Blabor have been about helping them out of possession and that kind of stuff. But Tealham and Santos is good on the ball. Kobe Man is obviously good on the ball as well, but they've got those midfield refresh that's supposed to be helping them with that. And it didn't look on Saturday, at least like the new signings had done too much to change their issues. They have, which are like I said, really long-standing going back to the Eric Tenhaag and arguably Ralph Ragnic days of when they have the ball and they're expected to dominate again, they're really struggle. Whereas in one-off games against bigger teams, where they can count attacking hit teams on the break with the pace of Kunya and Burma, Cesca, all those amazing attackers they have. They're great. But when it comes to the one that was most comparable to this last season, I could think of West Ham, where they drew one all and that was only a late Cesco goal. That's the kind of most comparable fixture I could think of in my head, where a team just sat back and tried to defend a lead. You know, I do have problems against those kind of teams and because they're better now than they have been in recent seasons, they're going to face a lot more of those kinds of teams in season. So that is an issue that Carrick's going to have to solve. An interesting transitional issue. Yeah, can I jump in here? Yeah, I would listen to Jamie Carrick's interview with Antoni Aureola on Sky this weekend. It's a really good interview, well worth checking out, but just a one sort of throw away line that Aureola put in there. He was talking about when you move from one team to another and you try and implement a new play style, you're saying every squad has a tempo that they're just naturally going to play out. Obviously, the players are going to play in a certain way. It's very easy to think of play styles as sort of over the top things, which you just sort of separate away from the players, right? But his point was players are going to play at their natural tempo and it's important not to move them too far away from that natural tempo. And I think that's a really nice way of explaining what the issues with Manchester United have been over the last five, six, seven seasons has been that they've consistently played in a very specific tempo. And then when they're required to play in these other games where they don't have the tempo players, it becomes a lot harder for them as well. You're making me think of JJ because JJ always says that if he tries to slow down what he's thinking, he can't think anymore. He can only think 100 miles an hour and that's why he speaks 100 miles an hour. But if he slows down, like if he's required to play patient build-up play, all of a sudden, he can't play football anymore, do you know what I mean? But it's a really kind of, I don't know, I don't know how you, I suppose maybe that's what they've tried to do right, bringing in these technical players like Eury Teelemens and Andrew Santos, but a lot of the conversations being about technical security, which I think is fair, but those players again, their instincts on the ball is to play direct passes to play penetrating balls through the lines. Bruno Fernandez is the same. We've talked about him at length across many seasons here as well. And I suppose that's the, for me, the most interesting concept is like, how do you change the mood of a team in that sense? It's true because I think the best chance that they created, which they didn't even result in a shot was in the first half. I thought we saw glimpses of what we might see throughout the rest of the season. Eury Teelemens was a little deeper. Man United, I don't know whether they'd done it intentionally or not, but they'd created somewhat of an artificial transition where Hull were a bit in a mid block, but they were deciding to press high. And Eury Teelemens chips the ball over to Bruno Fernandez, who just beats the off-side trap. Unfortunately, it gets chased down. He's probably not the player you want in that scenario. But I did wonder, you know, is this the kind of football we might see Manchester United try and play more regularly? Will it happen? Will it be different against teams that aren't Hull City? Who knows? One more question on the United before before we move on, Tom. Kyle already mentioned Carlos Belabor, a player that they're agreeing a deal with Brighton for at the moment. We know what he'll bring to the team out of possession. Is Carlos Belabor going to help address these in possession issues at all? Or is he just, we shouldn't be looking to him as a new midfielders help them break down teams like Hull? I'm not sure, to be honest, he's not the most kind of naturally progressive player. He's not in the mold of Teelemens or even Andre Santos, I'd say, but he does just give, you know, he's a very strong physical profile. He will definitely shore up the defensive. He can come up with moments, he's a very kind of powerful player. I mean, he's got a really amazing winning goal last season, right and the last minute kind of edge of the box. He can do that kind of thing, but no, he's not someone to rely on in that kind of situation, I don't think. I think, yeah, we just have to give flowers to Hull really. I mean, you look at the way they compacted the space in between the lines, they just, Fernandez could not get on the ball in the time that he wants to be on it and you look at the kind of the back three hole as well. I think Johnny, he can ended up making 17 clearances so you can see how amazing, unbelievable. And the two kind of wide centre backs as well, Mendy and his debut, obviously, they both scored, but very aggressive and proactive to make sure that even when United players did receive a ball between the lines, they were right on top of that. They also had to bring off both of their outside centre backs in a 64th minute and replace them, which I thought was, you know, that's the sort of thing that can definitely destabilise a team in that situation. You still got half an hour to play, so they did well to whether that's done. Oli McBurney looked good for the level as well, I thought. I think of score goals. That was a period where he sort of turned into almost messy, which is like, dribbling through about five different players and it looked even better on the replay. But I feel like with Hull, so a lot of people were predicted to be even worse than Derby, which was in retrospect, probably quite disrespectful, but they're already, I think with three points already, more than the quarter of the way to beating that tally now. But there are, so I have some reservations about going to over the top of like, they're definitely going to be fine, they're going to survive, which I don't think anyone's saying. But I don't think a lot of the criticisms were, they were probably overly harsh, but I don't think they were completely unfair. And this game kind of felt like a cup tie in a lot of it and the way they were defending. I don't know how sustainable that is across the course of a season where you're playing week in, week out, that kind of style. It will get them points and I don't think it's scoring from two set pieces. Yeah, I don't think there'll be anywhere near as bad as like a Derby, for example, but I kind of the bigger test for them is it's switched next week in the second game. That'll be kind of more of an indicator of their chances staying up I would say than this one off result. Yeah, I think it's interesting as well, because if you look at it's switch and commentary the way they've recruited, I think they have identified that they need to be able to survive more mentoring games in the Premier League. And they have bought players, their strikers, their wingers, to be able to counter attack, to be able to, you know, Emma Sunmanoeu, so it's striker, even commentary's new signing, I think you'll share if you look at the data, he's like a kind of powerful with archetype where he's going to be running in behind, he's going to be leading counter attacks by himself. I don't think Hull have really recruited that way. I think they're happy to stick with all the money because he does what he needs them to do. And, you know, they are happy to sit a little bit deeper, so it'll be interesting to see how that works, as Kaya said, we can wake up. I do think this raises kind of an interesting tactical meta question, because, and this is something that maybe we'll talk about a few times throughout this podcast, but it feels to me that this shift towards teams having to play more directly means that you will, it raises the profile of playing low block and counter football, because there's fewer teams now that are built to optimize purely breaking down a low block. And as a result, what we've started seeing is, you know, it happened quite a bit this weekend, right, teams who didn't have to do much other than score goals, they were happy to sit in a low block, absorb pressure, not give away too much, maybe pick up a few set pieces, leads one with a free kick after generating very little in terms of open play, equally forest on who were their opponents, and that game did pretty much the same thing. And I guess as well, I'm just trying to pull off the top of my head, but ever to beat Crystal Palace. And again, they sort of did their thing of, you know, you pick off, you take your chances, when they come along, you can make the argument, and Newcastle did that against Liverpool to an extent, had really devastating counter attacking moments. They did do that. Yeah. And I think we, I think we will see this throughout the course of the season now, it's that with that pep consensus collapsing a bit, there'll be teams who are going to be much braver about just not having the ball sitting deeper and, and, and, and, you know, letting, you can make the argument that Arsenal did this a little bit in the, in the community shield against City. So the 6040 possession in, in City's favour, but they didn't, they weren't able to do anything with it. It was, it means that teams can rest a little bit more off the ball. They don't need to have to be intense the whole time. They don't have to be high pressing. But also if you have the players who can have, you know, who can counter can attack directly. It's a good way of generating chances. But also, I think what we'll see with, with teams like Arsenal, I'm not going to be willing to just sit deep and absorb. They're going to have ways of jumping out and, and picking their moments to press high. But I think teams now have to be able to manage games physically and sitting in a low block for a few minutes is a good way of like catching your catching your breath, getting your getting everyone back ready to go again. Well, before, before we move on, one more thing to say on Manchester United, did a mutual friend of ours in football said this, I think of, of many United fans, maybe why they shouldn't worry too much about this opening game. He said, if they lose, they still aren't title challenges, which I think most people kind of knew before the season started. If they win, it's the worst team in the league. So we don't learn anything either way. There you go. Maybe we've learned nothing. Who knows? Anyway, right. Now, Steve, it's a little little early for a break. Is it should we crack on and do some Brentford and then come back and have a break after? What a great idea. What a great idea. Okay, Brentford three. Neil Tottenham well now. Brentford battered Spurs, didn't they? An absolute battering. It could have been more in a right Steve humbling three-neil defeat on Saturday. Mamadou Sangare had perhaps the best debut of the weekend. There was a very bad debut this weekend as well, but it wasn't that one. And Spurs, who still have major injury issues, fielded a weekend side, including now, this was my summary of the game, Kyle. A young midfielder at right back. That was Archie Gray. An old man at left back. That was a little bigger at Andrew Robertson. You still got it, Robbo. A striker and a midfielder who have both said that they want to leave at various different times. A teenager on the right wing, Mikey Morris. I don't think it was his full debut, but it was not far off. And then Matthias tell on the left. You know, just going to throw that one in there as a little bit of a dig. Now, anyway, not a team starting the game that really felt like it hugely reflected all of the money that they've spent. Although by the end of the game, they did have many of those players on. Tom, let me start with you. Does this game in which Spurs lost badly, and I will remind you were battered? Does this game tell us anything about how we think Roberto Deserbi's Spurs project is going to go? I mean, a little bit. What do you think it tells us? I think it tells us that they are going to find it more difficult than I think Brighton's Deserbi found it to play through the press because I think teams are pressing better. I think Brentford were unbelievable in terms of how aggressive they are, but also just the profiles of players in that press, right? They've got three attackers who are really aggressive and powerful. And then the three midfielders behind them, just the physicality of athleticism to push up and be brave and win all of their challenges. And then they can even rely on their full backs to push up if they need to as well, Lewis Potter and Coyote. It was, yeah, every time Spurs tried to build up, they didn't really have anywhere to go. They ran into issues and they just couldn't get through. So partly on, you know, that's down to Brentford being very good. I do think things will improve for Spurs when they get the right players in, when things kind of settle down a little bit. Savinia Mahmushri here are going to come in. Yeah, I think particularly in the first half, I think Van Hecker and Sunessi brilliant on the ball, really, really good at kind of progressing the ball up the pitch, stepping it forward into the channels, finding those passes. But first of all, I think without my taste for none, there's in the team, it's harder to find a midfielder. Tanali, maybe you can have a Madison or a Kulisewski in there moving around. And Mahmush to kind of drop and receive the ball with his back to goal. All of those things, I think, will help them progress a ball a little bit better than they did in the first half. But I don't think this Van Hecker, Sunessi partnership is massively sustainable just because of how suspect they are without the ball. I think both of them are quite aggressive. They want to jump up. And I think Van Hecker in particular, he knows that if he wins that first challenge, he's got the advantage. But when he doesn't win it, then he's got space to cover. He's not what the pace to do it. Actually, Gray definitely doesn't because he's a makeshift right back. I think there are problems there, and I think that is when Van Theven does need to come into the team. So yeah, I think heavily caveated by the fact, as we just said, it was a bit of a second string team. And I think things will get a little bit better when they have a little bit of rhythm. But there were signs that say that they're going to struggle a little bit. I think the second goal, actually, that they conceded was an interesting one because they worked the kind of early phase of the bill quite well. They found a pass into Richarlison, managed to escape the press a little bit. And I think when a lot of you seem to pressing them, they're having a wingers are coming inside a little bit, and there is space for the fallback to push on a little bit. And there is always that pass out to Robertson, but Richarlison held on to it for a little bit too long, loathable, and then they got counted. So I think if those kind of movements can be practiced a little bit, if players, for example, Marmouche might be a little bit better at doing that, then maybe they have a little bit more success. But yeah, it was a pretty dammit opening half in particular. It reminded me of, I think it even was Brighton and Brentford that played Eric Tenhargs, Manchester United at the beginning of his tenure. It reminded me of those games. Watching it in the first half, you were just left under no uncertain terms as to how shit they were. I mean, it was it was embarrassingly poor. They did start with Sandra Tenhargs, who's their record-signing. Mateus Venner has came on in the second half, Kaya. How did you feel about the performances of their new players? Well, it's interesting because Ali's book wrote in the athletic and his piece about it that only four of the 11 arguably once Marmouche and Savinio come in as expected, were the 11 you were expecting to start. It's kind of hard to judge this game. I kind of still in a series in the crisis as well. Yeah, they have a lot of injuries again. It's always seems to be the case with Spurs. I think the problem is for a club that seemed to be as almost intrinsically linked with crisis as Spurs have been in the past couple of seasons. Roberto Deservi isn't always the best at turning the temperature down on that. I think that's kind of an interesting question with a lot of the questions about him as a project manager and trying to build something which is not something he's necessarily done that much or successfully throughout his career. He had a great season at Bryson and it fell off and Marseille was quite boom and bust as well and Spurs want to build something long-term and sustainable. That's why they're giving him a five-year contract and backed him so heavily. In his post-match press conference, I thought it was interesting for a couple of things. The first one, which I quite liked was the fact he said we have one 2006 or 2007 playing, which is sort of a quite nice lost-in-transation kind of. What does that mean? It means a player born in 2006 or 2007? A football industry thing to do for a third to a player. But that's, I think, that's a foreign linguistic thing because my dad will always refer to me as a 97 birth, which regardless of how old, how far into the year we are. So my birth is July 29th, whether we're before or after I am in his mind, 29 this year. So that's an interesting work. So your dad basically thinks of you as if he was a scout. Yeah, 97 kids. Yeah, yeah. I'm lucky for Kai. He's on a 2027 contract. So that won't have to deal with that much longer, yeah. But I would love Mr. Kai now. Him using words like suffering and shocking and I guess that's still so many times. Well done, boys. What's that? Yeah, deserving also using words like suffering and shocking and they could just be quirks of translation. But I don't think they helped turn down the temperature on what is quite a difficult start to the season for spurs. And yeah, the midfield didn't look like it had much control. They went super direct and quite long to try and beat the Brentford press a lot, which I don't think necessarily helps the situation when you're going long to tell more and recharge and recharge this season in the air, but tell them more to smaller guys. So it's kind of harsh, especially against Brentford who are one of the most biggest and physical teams in the league. So I didn't see much. I think like Tom was suggesting to suggest that they're going to be this team that can control possession and bait teams with their press like Brighton did under deserving. There's been a few questions, but I don't think it's full crisis as I suggested. No, it's reality check. It's the same for Manchester United. It was reality check. In fact, you're reminding me that one of my major thoughts when I was watching that Manchester United whole city game, I was thinking about, was it the chic touch that came in with the offer for Bruno Fernandez? Galatasaroe. Galatasaroe, was it? He came in with the big offer for Bruno Fernandez and then Manchester United re-entered contract talks with him just to make sure that he was happy, whatever. I was just watching that game sitting there thinking when they're two nil down in the second half, they're not creating anything. If I was Bruno Fernandez, I'd just think, oh, fuck me, not, I get like, not this again. The impact of that on the first game of the season, and I'm trying to think who the equivalent, I suppose, don't have an equivalent of Bruno Fernandez. Archie Gray might be thinking that off. Well, no, but maybe but Archie Gray's a young player who I'm sure has got a lot of fight left in him. Bruno Fernandez is coming towards the end of his career, presumably wants to chill out a little. I don't know, maybe not. Robitson could be still like that. Yeah. He's like, oh, Christ, what have I done? Anyway, it's very much, very much a mixed room. But what have I done moments? And then also, reality checks for for fans, this and this is incidentally, I did not expect them to lose in the way that they did. So that's not me saying like, oh, you're going to spend all that money. You're going to be amazing. I'm sure a lot of suspense fans were very realistic about their chances this season. But you know what it's like when you spend loads of money in a transfer window and then you lose your first game. Was it three nil? Could have been four. Yeah. Three nil. One thing to add from this game before we move on, I have Igor Thiago and my fantasy team and he missed a penalty. I will never ever forgive you. That was there was there was a route. There was a route here. And I could have had points. Major points. I didn't. I wish I had Mamadou Sangare, John, record signing from Lons for I think it was Lons. Was it Lons? Yeah. About 41 million pounds. Delightful. Oh my God. He was absolutely fabulous. Wasn't he what a debut? Yeah. And it's funny that you mentioned your fantasy football team because we're doing a draft fantasy together. Only allowed teams that are outside of the big six. And it's the bottom half is basically the bottom half. This is what's so frustrating about it is that, you know, you get lucky and Brentford like on a round of Tottenham. I'm thinking great. I've got two Brentford players here. Igor Thiago is definitely going to score if they're winning three nils. Mrs. a penalty. And Pinnock didn't even fucking play. Yeah. Whereas I had Mamadou Sangare and I also had Michael Keo who scored. It's just luck. So it's all luck. Just 28 points from that which in fantasy draft. Wow. Bottom half. Let me tell you is is a good score. I had Pedro Poro. Well, you only got 28 points overall. No, just from those two players. How many what was your game week points title? Let's just let's just chat. I was right. 50ish. It won't be done yet. Well, it could still want more to go in. Don't worry, Steve. You're not in the special league. Let me find out what I got. Yeah. Thanks. The invite guys. Yeah. I was thinking that too, Steve. So I only got 34 points. Two of your players. Oh. Yeah. Sangare fantastic player. And, you know, what I was so impressed with about Brentford was just their ability to press high and the way that I think you know, in five years, we've gone from teams like Brentford who you would expect most of the time to be quite passive, even if they were going to press up higher. Yeah. They're just watching the game back and you see their center back step because obviously a big thing that deserves these game is built around is you bait the opponents forward and then you have these escape routes to find your way through the presses. And one of their gambles that they take is oh, if you're if your frontline players abandon the frontline and drop deep, it's unlikely the opponent's going to follow you all the way in. But this is what happened. The centerbacks were just brave and they stepped all the way up. That means that you're reducing one of their escapes. It becomes much harder. It's why, you know, Tottenham ended up having to play quite direct. And it's, you know, quite worrying, I think. If I were a spurs fan, I'd be worried about how quickly spurs just started going long in that first half. They started playing long goal kicks. And yeah, there's there's all kinds of questions that emerge. But we're talking about Brentford. Ahmed Wallad has written a piece on the site about Brentford's pressing, which is well worth going to have a read off. But yeah, this is the reality now is that teams who you'd previously have considered just sort of mid table sort of fairly passive mid block blocky teams and now going aggressive because they know that the payoff is there for them. The gamble is anyone can get it in the Premier League. And this is this is the point that we've made about Deserbys approach in the Premier League. We've just put up a video. There's gone live now on TIFO exploring some of those ideas about Deserbys approach, which have become maybe problematized in the modern game. And I did a video on the athletic FC talking about this stuff. It's, you don't need to bait presses anymore in the Premier League because opponents are going to press you. Tom's already mentioned, pressing is much better. These teams are able to go collectively, jump on and lock on man to man around the ball without leaving any gaps. And it just makes this kind of approach so much less likely to happen. So yeah, big questions about whether or not Deserbys approach or what it's going to look like in the modern age. I think there are ways of being able to make it work, but I certainly think that they've got a lot of thinking to do about it. Would you like some nerdy stats on Sangare? Just around off? I would love so. Thank you Tom. I think when you look at players from a kind of data perspective out of possession, they tend to be either very aggressive tacklers or very aggressive kind of interceptors and ball recoverers, so they're a little bit more kind of passive where they're just sweeping up rather than actually going in for things. Sangare is both. There's a metric called True Tackles, which we kind of use as a proxy for kind of how aggressive they are, how much they want to stick their foot in. Sangare was right at the top for under 23 midfielders last season. He was also right at the top of ball recoveries, so he does it both. And that is what makes him stand out so much because he's just everywhere all at once. He's amazing. He's also worth saying he is, he's fantastic on the ball as well and has this ability to sort of wrap passes through the lines as well, so he could be a real game changer for Brentford. Amazing. All right, let's have a quick break. And when we come back, we'll play a rondo. Welcome back from that delightful break. Now it's time for the most serious moment of the week. That's right. It's time for me to read my personal journal. No, I'm kidding. It's time. I don't have a job. Do you guys have a journal? No, no. I feel if I say yes, that could end badly for me. Guys, got a journal. All right, thoughts. Do you have a diary in sometimes? Yeah. I'll just not want again today. Dear diary, Joe was mean to me again. Ryan thought something that you've reminded me. My wife always laughs at me because she says one time we were sort of in bed sort of trying to go to sleep. And I was rolling around a little bit and she said, you're okay. And I said, what's in pickle? I don't remember this. I think I was sort of already asleep. And I was like, in that place, halfway between the dream and the waking state. Give me about pickle. And I realized I'm in Branson. In Branson. In the most Joe dream. In the rest of the world of pickle. In Branson. Pickle. I suddenly realized I've got no clue what's in Branson. Pickle. No clue. And she said, I don't know. And then I went, what is in pickle? Well, I looked it up and it was, it's basically just pickled little pickle vegetables. Vinegar. It's like little pickled carrots and stuff and other things. Yeah. I mean, dip pickles. But there's just like a dark sauce in it as well. Is that just I think that's the process of pickling the causes. So it just goes. What's in Branson's pickle? Pickles kind of an hour. They're subscribed to process. So there's, there's carrot, sweet onion and cauliflower that are pickled obviously. There's sauce and sweetness. Oh, sugar, barley, malt, vinegar, water. Do you think they have Branson's pickle in America? Do they know what it is? I wonder if it's on those, you know, the sort of world food stores that use roads that you see in like Canadian and American. To them is what Vegemite is to us. Yeah. It's brown sauce. Anyway, there's also some sulfite ammonia caramel in there. So caramel. Well, it's just coloring. I think caramel doesn't really always mean what you're thinking. You know, caramel doesn't always mean what you've been doing. I don't think it does. The caramel means to you, Kyle. What does it mean to me? Did I really? Anyway, listen, let's play a rondo. Now, very exciting. We've been working our way through a specific category of rondo and we're going to return to it today. Very fruitful, exciting category. Here's how the rondo works. I ask a question that has multiple correct answers. We go round in a circle. We give correct answers. If we give incorrect answers, we are rejected from the rondo. If we give answers that have already been given before, John McKenzie, active listening, we are rejected from the rondo. The final person standing is named Rondo Del Rey. And today's category is as follows. What I'm looking for simply is teams that are in this season's iteration of La Liga. Okay. That's Spain's top team. Spain's top team. Tom's going to win this. Why is Tom going to win this? Is he in my wheelhouse? Yeah. Is he a specialist, Tom? All right. Well, let's see. I'm going to say yes. I'm going to say yes. Just say you're a specialist. I'm a specialist. Oh my god. Oh my god. If he doesn't win, I know. If he doesn't win, it's huge. Okay. In which case, let's start with Kaya. Real Madrid. Well, Real Madrid are of course in there. John Barcelona. Barcelona are in there. That's the two ones that I know, Tom, Atlético Madrid. There you go. Now, see, I like the strap there of getting, you've got to go for the bigger teams first. Take out what they could say. Good idea, Kaya. I'm something of an expert, so I've heard of Sevilla. Ah, Sevilla, yes. I think they're top of the league right now. After one game. Valencia. Valencia. Real Betis. Let me just wait. Wait, wait. Whether or not that he's because they are. Valencia. It's not that it's just that I haven't got them in alphabetical order. I've got them in league order right now. So I've got to scan the list. Valencia are there. Real Betis. What do you say, Real Betis? All right. Yeah, we can have Real Betis, can't we? Real Sociedad. Real Sociedad you can have. Doing quite well so far, John. Vireal. Vireal. All there. Levante. Levante. Of course that ball of the league right now. I never know the correct way to say it because the fans are getting away if you say it in wrong way. Club athletic, athletic club. Athletic club. Yeah, you can have athletic. Yeah. Catafé. Catafé. Yeah, you can have Catafé. Raya by Eccano. Raya by Eccano. Yeah, it's getting a bit difficult. Mine. Would you like a clue, Kyle? I know what you're going to say. Would you like a clue? Yeah, you know what, Joe, I would love nothing more. Oh, the clue is you know all of these two. I don't know that I do know all these. You do. If I said them to you, you'd go, yeah, I know. Do you want to say them to me? No. Let's go. I've always taken his time. Four. I don't like how much time you're taking here, Kyle. It's a risk. I'm going to start to count you down from five. All right. Four, three, two, say team, one, say team, go. Possessina. Yes, you can have Possessina. Well done. Pressures on, John. Malaga. Malaga, you can have Tom Harris. Seltavigo. Seltavigo. Oh, there, of course. Now there are only five teams remaining. We've done pretty well. Kyle has had Tafé been said. Why do you want to say it? Yeah. It's been said, Steve, active listening has been terrible. Well, two things, active listening, but also he didn't actually submit it as a question. But based on your, if I was him, I wouldn't have done it because I heard you go, oh, no, you got to hold your emotional reaction. That's such a good suggestion. You got away with it. You got away with it with it. You're confused. You're out of the game. You're out of the game. John, it's down to you. Can you stop the so-called eggs butt? No. We'll try. So I'm thinking of a few different teams, most of whom I think are relegated. Okay. Or maybe don't even exist. I'm going to say, no, they're definitely not in the league. Oh, it's got another one. Well, it's too late now, Kyle. Did you run? I got relegated. I'm going to have to start counting you down. Steve Scott relegated for three, two, one, say a team, say a team, say any team, say a team. Go quickly. The first of the comes to your head. Say football team. Maritomo. I've bought you. Okay. You're out. You're out. All right. Now, Tom, can you get one more in order to win the game? L-J. L-J. Okay. So well done. Congrats. Firstly, congratulations. Thank you. You've been named Rondo Del Rey. Secondly, you said you're an expert. There's four teams remaining. Can you name them all? I've got three. Okay. So rassing Santander. That's correct. Yeah. Deportivo Alavez. Yes, well done. Oh, I've got four. Deportivo La Coruña. And Espanyol. Well, there he goes. He got the whole. The expert named all the teams in the league. Thank you. We couldn't have won to my lap. Even if I had listened. You never could have won. No, absolutely right. Congratulations, Tom. And well played to both of you. Thanks for somewhat. I mean, less so to you because of active listening. I'll take a win over Kaya to be fair. Yes. And Portuguese team. No, I'm going to say that Portugal and Spain are the same and that there are no differences in cultural knowledge between them and that they're identical countries. We've all heard of Galicia. That's basically a mixture of the two. It's exactly. No, exactly. Exactly that. Right. Now, where do we go now? Well, we go. Let me just get it up where we go. Oh, yeah. I found where we go, guys. I was worried there for a second. I didn't know where we were going, but now I know where we're going. And it's all the way to where we have gone if you didn't find out where we were going. Well, who know? I mean, isn't that the tree? That's the true tree of the teeth of the football box. You never know where you're going, dude. Until you find that you're in the northeast with Newcastle, too. Too livable. Well, a 95th minute Dominic Zobbosly penalty rescued a point in and Donnie Aureol's first game as Liverpool manager, following goals from Anthony Alanga, Cody Hackbo and Joe Willock. Newcastle's promising performance was also Matthias Jai Ant Matthias. I have to keep remembering to say Matthias when they're German. Matthias. Matthias Jaisler's first game in the dugout for the magpies, but did we really learn that much about either coach? Well, let's find out. It was a very interesting game, John, from a Newcastle perspective. Obviously, in the midfield, you know, the big story for Newcastle this summer, Bruno Gimmer and Iaxe and Sonali both gone. They started the game with 20-year-old Lewis Miley, who wears number 67, who I thought was actually very good in the game. An 18-year-old Sean Sturr is the Iaxes, isn't he? Sturr. He's a new player from Iaxe. I thought they were very good on the day, but you kind of mentioned already that they did play in a bit of somewhat of a low-blocking counter-style. Yeah. There was interesting watching, again, we've talked already about it being weird watching Man City without Guardiola and the dugout. It's actually kind of weird watching Newcastle without Eddie Howe and the dugout as well, because I think they sort of become quite not predictable, but we knew how his playstyle sort of well. We knew how. Yeah, and this felt quite different from that. Not just because Matthias Jaisler was dressed for a cocktail party. I don't know if you saw his James Bond style, so he looked exceptional. He also did this thing when the penalty was given, because it was the last thing in the game, where he sort of half-took his shirt off and gave it a massive F-bomb, and I was like, yeah, go on, hold me back! Yeah, I love that. I just love when someone can, he's obviously not done anything in the UK before, but he's one weekend and he's already swearing, fusedly on the sideline in English, swear words, which is quite fun. Yeah, I thought they were really smart in their transition moments. I think they were smart, you know, playing a langer on that side, trying to hit the space behind Kirk-Ezz. He's in my fantasy team, thank you. As is your and Wissar, I will say this stage, yeah. So you've got some points from them? Yeah, and Wissar unfortunately. He didn't miss a botched all of his chances and got a yellow card, so I don't know. Maybe at the end of the game week, he'll be rewarded for his man of the match contribution. You have to trust the process, I think. Getting a siss for the second order, he did, yeah, nice and points. Sure, it's some, but it's not as many as 28. That's true, yeah. But yeah, this is a kind of interesting game, because you sort of have to balance off two things, right? On the one hand, Liverpool were obviously fault for both of the goals they gave away, but Newcastle did everything correctly in those two scenarios, I thought that, you know, there's a reason why Pep Guardiola spent most of his career keeping the opposition as far away from his goal as possible with all of that distance to travel, because it's actually quite hard to move the ball with very few players in those scenarios. That second goal, the way that you and Wissar tripled through for players, it was absolutely outstanding. And I thought, I think that was a recurring aspect of this game, really. The ability of Newcastle players to receive the ball and then just ball carry and Liverpool players struggling to actually make the challenge. And yeah, some interesting, I mean, this is maybe a bit of a segue away from what we're talking about with Newcastle, but I thought it was quite interesting that with Liverpool under Eurel, what you get is you want to have players with mobility who arrive in these moments to slow opponents down. But often when you arrive in those moments at speed, that speed can be used against you and actually really good defensive players with mobility are the ones who have the ability to decelerate and then are able to make the jewels more successfully, if that makes sense. And I felt there was lots of examples of Liverpool players arriving with speed into these jewels, but not being able to decelerate properly. And therefore, Newcastle were able to carry through these pressure moments quite a lot. That will probably be an ongoing issue for Liverpool players going forward. But I think really good from Newcastle to just be very efficient, I thought, they didn't have what 40% possession again. So again, we're in that wheelhouse of teams who are willing to just allow the opponent to have the ball absorb the pressure and then make the most of those moments when they attack directly. Now we know that Yisler comes from that red ball background. So the ability to attack space directly and through the middle in particular, is going to be good there. And I thought they were really good in this game of doing that. Well, on that note as well of the speed, the intensity of Newcastle's attacks under Yisler, I thought this was interesting. Chris Woff wrote this in his post-match piece. Nick Valtemarder didn't even come off the bench. And it's unclear where the German fits into Yisler's team and style. And on Euryola, the Liverpool head coach described Newcastle as quote, one of the fastest front lines in the league. This is after the game obviously. And it's obvious that Yisler's vertical football requires pace up front Tom Harris. I thought I quite enjoyed Nick Valtemarder at times last season. But based on how well you and Wissler performed yesterday, Anthony Alanga, as well, you can see why it's obvious that those two players would have a future in this team based on the fact that we think their transfer business might not be done either. Would you be concerned that Nick Valtemarder might not fit in? Missy is Yisler's Newcastle? Potentially. I mean, I must admit, I'm not as across Yisler's coaching career as maybe others are, but I didn't even know who was at work. I was thinking about Seb on that. You're an expert in this. But I think he is a little bit more, I mean, when we had Seb on a couple of weeks ago, he said he's more than just a Red Bull coach. You know, there are like elements that he will like to to mix things up. So I think Valtemarder is an interesting, I mean, he's a very unique player, isn't he? He's a good player to have around. He's great. And yeah, he's very good. So I think no need to get rid of him, specifically when, you know, they are having such problems in a transfer window and losing a lot of best players keep him around. And he might come in, come in handy, but yeah, definitely the speed. I mean, I was just looking now, data from our good friend's skill corner, they have a metric called top three peak velocity, wow, which basically takes a player's top three speeds right across a season and then takes an average. And it's basically a way to say, you know, they are able to reach for the speed pretty consistently, but it's also that the top speed that they're able to reach top 20 in the top five leagues less season of players. Anthony Gordon is in there. Anthony Alanga is in there. And Bazemarna Tore is in there, who they have just signed from off and high, who has not played, I don't think he came on in that Liverpool game. So yeah, definitely looks like they're going to double down on that approach. And with Osula as well, he doesn't quite reach the speeds, but I think he's one of my favorite players in the Premier League because he was so exciting, chaotic, but in a good way, he makes it work. He was also limping for about 20 minutes yesterday, that then he came back on in the second half. I thought, what was wrong with his foot? What could have possibly happened to that man? Anyway, terrific. Well done for Newcastle. Osula is interestingly kind of a way that unlocks Fisher a little bit. If you think back to what he was like at Brentford, when he played his breast football, him and Embermo, I think both got 20 goals in one season together. And they kind of, they weren't isolated from one another. They were working together doing quick counter attacks. Osula and Vista can probably, they have similar profile and skill sets to be able to pull that off. So I think the way the isoler seems to be playing does feel like you can get the best out of Vista in a way we didn't see last year, partly because of injuries, but also partly because sometimes he was a bit isolated up front. I don't think this is someone who can kind of play alone, nine striker, he needs a bit of support with him, which when Newcastle counterattacked yesterday, they did so in numbers and he had players up front with him. And he had shown in those kinds of situations. I know John spoke about decision making, but he had shown in those quick transitions he can be quite effective at and make the right decisions. So yeah, I have a sneaky suspicion that if that continues at a front line, then we'll see a lot more of the best of your investment. I have to say also on that basis, I'm quite pleased for Newcastle fans because it's been a rubbish summer for them, losing, you know, lots of their favorite players and their best players to have a player that they bought last season who, you know, there was an argument for him being the worst transfer of last year on the basis of injuries and performances. To have him have a game like this in the first, it feels like a new signing, doesn't it? It's nice. Anyway, there we go. Well done. Right. On Liverpool, though, not a terrific stuff. Perhaps not unexpected. We spent a lot of time talking about how many games and Donnie Eriella is allowed to lose or perform poorly before, you know, we can accept that things take time. What do we, do we learn anything about Liverpool from this game beyond what we knew already, which is that he's going to have to learn how to break down low blocks? Yeah, I mean, I feel as though we did learn something about Eriella's Liverpool from this game that wasn't in the ballpark of narratives that we've had so far. I thought Liverpool were largely fine. It was just, they had those two moments where they've really poorly defended those, the transitions and we could break down both goals and talk about the things that went wrong. I've done the Did you notice video on, on this issue? The concept? That's right. Yeah, the concept of rest defense, which means you'll decided to take a drink at the same time. It's because you start to worry about rest defense. You're settling in for the ideal idea of rest defense drink. Just a drink. A little hydration break, though. But yeah, obviously, I think people who listen to this podcast will know rest defense is essentially like how well you structured when you have the ball. How well you structured when you have the ball to be able to deal with losing it. Yeah. And there's lots of elements that come into that. So I think the biggest one that people talk about is the structure itself. So if you look at the moments when the breakdown happens, when Liverpool lose the ball before Newcastle attack, the centrebacks, for example, are very deep. They don't have great access to the players in the middle. But in the first one, well, in both examples, you've got Graven Birch, who is nominally the deeper lying of the two pivot players, carrying the ball forward into the towards the edge of the box and vacating that space in the middle. And obviously, if you do that, then you have to think about the ramifications of if you lose the ball in this scenario. How is how are we going to be able to defend that? Where's the rest? Yeah. Where's the rest of the people doing? Yeah. I've got a little, can I give you a little, I just want to gift you something. Okay. Thanks. Because I know you're often find yourself in your career having to explain what rest defense is. Tom, maybe you'll be useful as well. Here's, I've been thinking about a way of describing it in a sort of nice, concise way. Do you want to hear it? Yeah. Here we go. Here we go. Now, kids, when thinking about rest defense, it's not sleep over. It's left over. Oh, nice. You like it? Yeah, that's good. Try it on yourself. Who am I addressing? Well, the camera and start by saying kids. Kids. Yeah, that's weird myself. I'm not sure if I like this. They're not keeping it pushed through. When it comes to rest defense, we're not worried about sleep over. We're worried about left over. Now, interesting, interesting. You added extra words in there. I was just improving it. No, you made it less concise. I think that you really appreciate how to present things for a video audience. You introduced the concept of worry when you're talking to children. You know, very strange, isn't it? That's a bit of a, I think that might be a kind of Freudian insight into your psyche there. Always worried about something, isn't it? Oh, is the Premier League going to be more chaotic now? I'm worried. Anyway, what were you saying about Liverpool? Oh, yeah, we're talking about rest defense. Oh, yes. Yeah. Yeah. Not sleep over. Yeah. But there's lots of different things. I mentioned the structure stuff. So there's definitely improvements that can be made there, which will, I think, they will be made. It does maybe raise questions about the usefulness of grab and birch in this system, because I think if he's going to be used as the deepest lying midfielder, but his imposition upside, it largely comes through ball carrying. Then you have this scenario where you're regularly going to be opening out that kind of space. Now, there's ways you can solve that with structure. And you can argue that that was what happened for the second goal, because sob as I, and actually, it's had much better access to viscer, I think, in the second goal. In the first one, it was just the ball came out into the middle, and there was just no one there. The centre backs were too deep. And then the Newcastle players were able to get the run on. But there's also decision-making aspects as well. So for the first goal, Graham Birch carries the ball through. He has, it's actually quite poorly defended, I think, from Liverpool. No, Newcastle. Newcastle. It was why it was a fifth official. It was fairly poorly defended by Newcastle. I mean, he takes a really nice touch and gets into that space. Which goal are you talking about? The first Newcastle goal. Oh, so better. Because it's rest defence, right? So Liverpool are doing with the ball. Yes. So he gets to the edge of the box, and there's two, he has two, well, yes, three options. He has the option to maybe play in Sob as I threw in, and he's probably thrown on goal, and you might generate a chance there. Arguably, it's like, it's not great for his, what the kid's called, angle bias. When he's running in that direction, it's kind of hard for him to get his right foot around the ball to play it. Yes. The other thing he could do is just take a shot. And if he does either of those two options, what you're doing is you're taking the ball out of the danger area, and it's either going to go into the goal or out of play probably, which means that you're not going to be at risk from your structural deficiencies. In the end, he plays like a really risky pass across the box. Newcastle can just run onto it and then exploit the space. Got it. But then there's other decisions as well for the second goal in terms of the out of possession stuff, where both Sob as I and Viet's are right by Vissa when he carries the ball through them. And you're just thinking at this point, I mean, I talked before about you expect your players to be able to defend those jewels better, the deceleration stuff I was talking about before, where someone like Sob as I will arrive very well into those jewels. But sometimes when he over commits, he doesn't decelerate well. And then it gives the advantage to the opponent. But both of those players have the opportunity to just pull him down, tactical foul. They've conceded a goal like this in these conditions already. Just take the yellow card and don't worry too much about the ramifications of that. I think would be the instructions. But I think it's what we learned from Liverpool is that actually these areas of the areas that we weren't talking about with Iriola. We weren't saying, oh, yeah, Iriola's teams are going to have bad rest defense. I don't think. You could say maybe they're going to over commit and the games are going to be transitional and that puts you at risk at these things. But I felt like in terms of the structure, there's nothing about Iriola's game that can't solve those problems was without that won't just break his system altogether. So there are fixes there that they will do. And again, I think it comes down to what you were saying before, how much time does he get? Actually, I think if I was a Liverpool fan, I would be quietly encouraged. Not by the game, I thought the game there was lots of sloppiness in there. But you know, it took 10 games for Bournemouth to get to a level where they were able to actually compete. Liverpool already much more accelerated, I would say, in that process. And the good news is I think is that it's one of those things where everything aggregates quite quickly. As soon as everyone starts getting it, then I think the improvement will happen right overnight. It's going to happen overnight. Well, now we're leaning back into the more sort of sleep side of racing. But the reason why it's difficult is because everyone has to do the right thing, right? So there's so many moving parts. But then when, so it looks bad, but then it will just be, usually it will just be a sort of click a moment where everyone starts getting it. And then, and then it just, you think, I remember that Bournemouth run where I was just like, this is, this is just looks irredeemably awful. Like, I can't see this turning around. And then it just happened very quickly. John Langke said, didn't need an interview. He said, it suddenly became natural embedded, I think, with the words he used, which I think is an important point. It does just become second nature, yeah, but it will take time. Yeah. Okay. Well, also, I think of a fans boy by the improved pre-season connection between Alexander Ezek and Florian there as well. So maybe there could be something of the sort of second season, you and this, and us about those two players. Who knows? Well, we'll find out now. It's time for a quick break, isn't it, Steve? Yes, please. Yeah. And when we come back, we will talk about Manchester City Bournemouth and a little bit on Arsenal Coventry. And we'll try and make the show as long as possible so that it ruins Steve's day. Yes, we're back now. Okay. Manchester City 2, one Bournemouth, Manchester City, narrowly avoiding an opening day to feed to Bournemouth with late goals from Mark Gahey, the midfielder, the newly branded Mark Gahey. And you're so proud of you all, who I can't say is newly branded as a nine because he's been playing there the whole time. That's what's called Yoshko. Is he? Oh, Steve. Oh, well, Steve Hanky. Yosep, do you know why it is? It's because actually what I did when I edited this last night was I changed Gvadiol from Gwadiol because I think Steve does the first draft and then he comes and tidies that up a little bit later. Maybe you were thinking of Pep Gwadiol. I was thinking of Pep Gwadiol. His full name is Yosep. Yeah. Yeah. You've got a little bit confused. Yeah, on the old championship manager games, it was Yosep Gwadiola. There's a little insight there into Steve's mind. How about that? It took him back to a happier place. Yeah, the specter of Gwadiol. Let's backpedal from here. Now, for Bournemouth, what looked like a bit now this is written by Steve. It's not like absolutely clear. Right, Steve. For Bournemouth, what looks like a bed of roses turned out to be a bed of forms as those sweet, sweet cherries were stung in Marco Roses first competitive game in charge. There we go. Do you wonder about how the name Marco Rosa presumably that's just the English word Rose. Presumably at some point he had an English ancestor. What is Rose in German? Let's see. It's Deroza. Oh, yeah. Yeah, no, no, it's Deroza. Yeah, so if he was English, he'd just be Marco Rose. Exactly. But that's not like an English migration word word. Well, English is a Germanic language. There's other way around arguably that we got roads from German. So here we go. Having a look at it now, the surname Rose has multiple independent origins across Europe, primarily deriving from the flower, descriptive nicknames, and ancient Germanic personal names. So there we go. How about that? Germanic personal. In some English and French traditions, it derives from the medieval female personal name Roses or Roses. This originates from the from permanently. This originates from the ancient Germanic elements. Roses. Marco. Anyway, aren't you? No, I'm from the Northwest. I'm actually allowed to do that accent. I don't know if you know this Tomhouse, but I was born in Lancaster. I did not know that. And I lived there for 10 years. Yeah. And no one will ever take it away from me. Anyway, I don't even know if that's accurate. No, no, nothing. Marco Roses. You're nothing, Marco Roses. Do you know how sort of existentially confusing it is to be born in a place that you can't pronounce correctly? Can you pronounce Lancaster? Yeah. I was born in Gorgate, is what I would call it, but everyone in the Northwest calls it. I don't know if they call it Galgate. It was like, oh, Galgate, Lancaster. Lancaster. Lancaster. I struggle with correctly pronouncing my first name in Turkish. So yeah, it's Erman. Oh, Erman. Yeah, yeah. But I actually struggle with the Er sound. I just, yeah, it's because I was, I guess, English my first name. You wouldn't if you're from Burnley though. No, Erman. That's right. You know, maybe the people of Turkey and the people of the Northwest of England have something in common could be. Yeah. There always, there always go, there always saying, er, er. Okay. Well, we've achieved making the show longer for Stephen. Anyway, what was I saying? Oh, yes, that's right. We got sidetracked on the sweet cherries. Now, now, now, now, now, Tom, Tom, Tom, Tom, Tom. This we're narrowly avoiding an embarrotentially embarrassing, although not so embarrassing these days, because Bournemouth are a known quantity, aren't they? narrowly avoiding that, that defeat. What does Enzo Marasca done? Is this the same Manchester City that we saw last season under Pep Guardiola? Is it different? Do you, is it too early to say? Um, too early to say, but different, I mean, a lot of different things. Oh, really? Um, and I think actually in the first 20 minutes, Bournemouth were a little bit all over the shop, because they didn't really know what was going on. I think even me trying to watch it, I was like, what is happening here? Right. And I think that worked in City's favour, because they were able to get Nico Reilly into really good positions, and to answer menu as well. I think they were to stand out players from this game for me. They were really, really good at carrying the ball forwards. Yeah. But yeah, um, Mark Gahey kind of played in a, in a midfield role, as you mentioned. Um, I think he did very well. Um, I just wear the number six on his back. He does. That is a very good point. And Anderson number five, I'm not quite sure. Although in Brazil, the number six is number five. They love it in Brazil, right? Yeah. Enzo Fernandez wears it for that reason, right? I think so, yeah. It's your junior too. Joginio as well. But yeah, I don't know. I think Gahey was very good. I think he did everything needed to do, but I think it was just a little bit of kind of awkwardness sometimes when he got the ball in advanced areas, and that's completely understandable. He's a centre back. He has played in midfield before, but he's not in his natural position. And I think the idea from Oresco was to kind of shore up the rest defenses we were just talking about drink. Everyone will have a drink for city to be a little bit more proactive on the loss of ball to pounds and to be able to nick it back straight away. But I think city's out possession shape more generally was just too big. There were just too many gaps to plug. And Gahey and Anderson as well were just caught out of position slightly quite a lot. And that allowed Bournemouth to really accelerate and counter attack, which I did really, really well quite a few times. So I definitely think there are things to fix. I think city did have a lot of a ball in kind of a on the edge of the box, but couldn't really get through because I mean, Rico Lewis as well. I'm a big fan of his, but I think he is a little bit ineffective as well when he's on the edge of the box in tight spaces. He's just not got that kind of power to really get through the ball and make things happen. And I think you saw the difference as soon as Ryan Checky came on because not just the two assists, but some of them, he can just change their actions so well. And that just opens up so many passes, so many like little fru balls into the box. And that just makes it a completely different team. Well, that's what gave me some cause to think that city were quite lucky to come away with three points because the first goal that they scored was it was from a corner for Mark Gahey's header. It was a moment of bizarre defensive laps on the case of Bournemouth, who defended very well to that stage that Mark Gahey was completely unmarked in the middle of the six yard box. And it also required a bit of a deflection in order to go in as well. And then Ryan Checky, in some ways it's harder to say that it's lucky when a player does something amazing because he is an amazing player, AKA he will do amazing things. But Ryan Checky's turn and pass for the second goal. It's just one of the best things I've ever seen. I mean, he's so good, isn't he? I don't why did he not start the game? I think maybe to do with those rest defense concerns. Because I mean, Checky, when he came on, he actually really went for it. And I don't know whether that was a message to to Maresco where he thought, well, I've got 20 minutes here. I'm going to run about and I'm going to really put myself around. But yeah, generally speaking, he's not as good. Not so much in terms of application, but I think he can let kind of people go behind him. He can kind of, you know, if you're trying to press and there's a movement in behind him, he's a little bit slow to react to that at times. So probably that's why he didn't start. But I think he has to now because there was those moments. There was another moment. I think there was a chance for, I want to say, Foden, where he kind of, he was, he was surrounded by three or four players and he just kind of did a, you know, left foot right foot pass through the gap. And you just like, no one else could do that on the pitch. I think apart from Mo Salah, I've never seen a player that reminds me of Messi so much. I just don't understand why you wouldn't try to like build a team around. Yeah, I think that will be the thinking going on. But I do think, as we know with Moreska, he does, you know, like to tinker. He likes to change things a lot here. He likes to, he's very adaptable as well. I don't think we give him a lot of credit for, you know, he kind of says that he's a dogmatist. He does the same thing every time. But you know, within that game, he brought on my taste. Noona's, he kind of saw the need to have a bit more of a kind of direct fallback and a runner in behind. And he changed that when it was required. But yeah, I think he will have seen enough from Cherokee that to suggest that he has to play. Just before we move on, did you see anything different for Bournemouth under Marco Rosa, his first Premier League game as well? Maybe a John question to be fair. I didn't watch the game so well. There are no. There'll be plenty of opportunity to talk about Bournemouth this season. So we don't have to. I mean, they were very good. I do think hard actually following that Donnie Ariel. Yeah, I think similar kind of concepts. I think Antonio Silva looks really good, really composed, actually, in the centre of defence considering he's 22, I want to say. He doesn't look the biggest. He doesn't look as imposing as I thought he would do. But every time the ball came his way, he dealt with it kind of minimal fuss. So that was really good. Tavenir, absolutely excellent. I think one of the best players in the Premier League to be honest in terms of the effort that he puts in and the kind of technical abilities got to go with it as well. So I think more of the same. Didn't watch it in too much detail. I was focused on City, but yeah, I think we can expect Bournemouth to be very difficult to beat. Okay. There we go. Man City getting a victory there over to the other big team. Arsenal now. They were very excited. They all Friday night. Arsenal played, of course, on Friday. 3-0 against Coventry City. Right, Steve, it's a beautiful new day in the Premier League. As reigning Champions Arsenal kicked off the 26-27 season with a 3-0 win over the Sky Blues Coventry City. With so many of their rivals struggling in the opening game week, it feels like they're aimed to cloud in the sky for the gunners. At the moment, again, right, Steve. Now, Kaya, it's hard to know, isn't it really what we learned from this game? A bit like we talked about with Manchester United and Hull earlier. If Arsenal win, then they're playing against Coventry, obviously, if they lose, we would have learned a lot, and that would have been more fun for you, for me. Yeah. I guess we learned that... Don't say solace first. Please don't say so. We're talking about Christos Solace, and you were implying that I had no right to use. Can I do a little impression of all Arsenal fans? I think you're gonna. Would you mind? Hold on. In fact, I'm going to pretend to be on the third jump when you pick up it. Hello. Hey, Dad. Hi, there, Joe. How's it going? It's going great, Dad. Hey, did you watch the game? The opening game of the season, yeah. Well, what other game would we have watched? We only watched Arsenal. We don't watch any other teams. Yeah, that's true. Yeah. I did watch it. Yeah, I put my 26-27 champion shirt on and 25-26. 25-25-25. I was just looking ahead, son. Yeah. Can you believe how perfectly the masterminded Arteza, Megabrain, wet-brain plan, transfer window plan worked out? Incredible. Phase 49 is going super well. I can't believe all of those idiots elsewhere fell for that vanissia's junior stuff. We'd never wanted him, did we? We wanted Christos Solace from the beginning. It's all part of Arteza's great plan. Yeah. Okay. I love you, Dad. I love you, son. Bye. Bye. You've been hacking into mine and my dad's phone calls. Reading your diary. Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, go on. Talk about, listen. Listen, I'm going to say this now for the starting. I like Christos, Solace. Me too. I want to explain, okay. Everyone listening will understand. They have friends who support a different team. Yeah, it's me, don't like. Who over, overdo it with a thing like the problem is, right? You and Steve, we're talking about Christos Solace. Before he'd done anything good, just because he's done good stuff now, it doesn't prove that you were right at the time. It just proves that you were hopeful at the time, okay? So I'm getting that out of the way. I am claiming the right to like Christos Solace without it sort of, well, it kind of confirming your foot that we were right. No, you weren't right all along. All along. Anyway, he had a good game, didn't he? He had a brilliant game. Oh my God. Who could have seen it coming? Yeah. He was good. Thank you. The interesting thing from an asked perspective is Martin Erdogard, Kai Haberts and Bakaia Saka were all in the same team, and Ben White also was getting forward on the right hand side. They linked up nicely for the third goal. A lot of the players who missed last chance of last season due to injury in the community shield and in that commentary game have looked pretty good, which is quite exciting for Arsenal. And I don't want to say this, but they do. What's he going to say? Like, they're definitely going to win the game. I see. But they do look like the team who I'll say it for you on the basis of the first weekend. And also based on everything we know about the other big teams, Arsenal are surely the heir apparent to the league. They have to open a game. Can you give the air to your own crown? Yeah, of course. The last season city beat Wolves 4-0 and everyone was like, oh, that's it. Tijani Rinders is the best player in the world. Yeah, that's true. So you've got to learn the lessons of previous seasons that one weekend does not a swallow make. Wait, summer. Summer. Not everyone said that. You didn't know. I said Wolves should have scored four goals in that game. Do you remember? I said that city had serious transitional defensive issues. You did also say that Wolves would probably stay up in the face of that. That's true. I said that. You can't get them all right, Joe. You can't. No, but I think it's fair to say that before before before before a ball was kicked, but also after all the balls have been kicked in the first weekend, Arsenal, all the balls. No, no, no, that's true. We have we have tonight may may may be fallible turn out to be champions, but Arsenal favorites, Arsenal favorites, it's fair, it's fine. It's okay. You have to accept that. Now you've won the Premier League. You can't, isn't there's no such thing as cursing it by saying it out loud. Come on, just say it. Definitely such a thing as that. Just say it. No, so say it. Christos Solis is massive everywhere he goes. There we go. Does anyone wish to say that Arsenal aren't favorites for any reason? I mean, I've got reasons for why I would no want to say it. Mainly involving Kaya. Unfortunately, I think that they they will be favorites this season. Well, one final caveat again, I know a lot of Arsenal fans think that we are an anti-Arsonal podcast. I wonder why. Well, because A, we are. But only because we have Steve and Kaya here. It's just balance. This is the thing that they are both massive Arsenal fans. John and I see it as our duty to offer the balance there. And two, they're really, really annoying. They're so annoying. True. They're so annoying. It's the most annoying. They were the most annoying combination of people in my life. And you haven't met all of my family members. So you can't understand how serious that is. Okay. In what a specific way, though. That's it. It's the end of the show. I think it's the end of the show. We've got time. We've got time. Right. We'll be back this week on. We're back on Thursday. That's right. Who have we got on Thursday? Oh, yeah, Ruben Pender. That's right. We'll talk about Crystal Palace. We'll try and talk about Everton a little bit there. Oh, yeah. We've got we've got a new guest on Thursday as well. So that'll be very exciting. And we'll talk about the full-arm Chelsea game. We'll talk about Brighton and Aston Villa. That was a really fun one. And then later in the week, there'll be a ring for analysis that publishes on Saturday. We will be live on Sunday for the second weekend of the Premier League immediately after the 4.30 PM game. What is that game on Sunday? I wrote it in the script and I now can't find it. It's which town against Manchester United. Oh, yeah. Okay. There you go. Another opportunity for many United to drop points against the promoter. See? God, they've had an easy start. Incredible. Anyway, let us pen you coming up this week. So I hope you enjoy it. But until then, John McKenzie, thank you. Thank you. Tom Harris, thank you. Thank you very much. Kaya Kainak, thank you. Crystal Solis. Oh, near the Kaya. Very good. I should say. And Steve Hanky was also here. Good bye. There we go. It's right. We'll be back later. See you.