🎙️ Football Social Daily •September 14, 2026 •⏱️ 27 min

VAR wrong AGAIN as pitiful United lose to spirited City in Manchester derby

1. Executive Overview: Core Theses & Key Revelations

The post-mortem of the modern Manchester derby rarely turns on a single incident, yet the latest clash at Old Trafford served as an uncomfortable mirror for both institutions. When Phil Foden received his marching orders in the twentieth minute, conventional wisdom dictated that Manchester United held the definitive tactical leverage. Instead, seventy minutes of numerical superiority exposed a profound structural reality: Manchester United remain entirely reliant on reactive transition football, fundamentally lacking the positional framework required to break down a compact mid-block. As analyst Joel Tudor bluntly observed, United could have played for another ten days without finding the back of the net. The dismissal did not grant United an advantage; it inadvertently gifted Enzo Maresca’s Manchester City their ideal defensive posture.

"We could have played that game for another 10 days and we wouldn't have scored." — Joel Tudor

Beyond the immediate ninety minutes, the panel on Football Social Daily—featuring host Nile McCorn alongside analysts Joel Tudor and Marley Anderson—unpacked systemic fissures stretching across squad architecture, recruitment philosophy, and refereeing governance. The core theses established across this seminal broadcast can be synthesized into five pivotal revelations:

  • The Red Card Paradox: Phil Foden's early ejection stripped Manchester United of open-field transition space. Confronted with a low-block, United's lack of positional play mechanics, half-space rotations, and qualitative width rendered their numerical advantage entirely redundant.
  • Carrington’s Recruitment Deficit: Summer acquisitions framed by executive leadership as "smart, cost-effective business"—such as Youri Tielemans (£35m) and Andrey Santos (£50m)—stood in stark contrast to game-defining, high-profile recruitment exemplified by Elliot Anderson. Compromise signings have left United averaging nearly two goals conceded per match, with fullbacks Diogo Dalot and Patrick Dorgu exposed against ten men.
  • The Rashford Anomaly as Systemic Evidence: The starter status of Marcus Rashford on the left wing—a player actively marketed for an exit throughout the summer window—symbolizes a deep operational disconnect between long-term squad planning and matchday reality.
  • The Forensic Fallacy of Pro-Ref (PGMOL): The officiating controversy surrounding Erling Haaland’s goal, where an offside Enzo Fernandez launched himself at the cross without physical contact, highlighted the administrative failure of VAR. By obsessing over microscopic touches rather than obvious spatial interference, VAR officials suffered from cognitive paralysis, prompting a post-match apology from the rebranded refereeing body.
  • The Premier League Dual-Monopoly: The title race has hardened into an early-season duopoly between Arsenal and Manchester City. Consistency over thirty-eight matchdays, underpinned by elite squad depth and individual match-winners like David Raya and Elliot Anderson, will dictate the destination of the trophy in late May.
Analytical Pillar Manchester United Status Manchester City Status Macro Narrative & Context
Tactical Identity Pure transition dependency; zero positional build-up framework against low blocks. Adaptable spatial control; seamless transition into compact 4-4-1 mid-block under Maresca. Red card eliminated open-field space, exposing United's structural impotence.
Midfield Profile Kobbie Mainoo isolated; lack of physical duel dominance and vertical ball progression. Elliot Anderson dominant; complete control of tempo, duels, and second balls. Midfield gap highlighted difference between potential and world-class execution.
Squad Construction Compromise transfers (£35m Tielemans, £50m Santos); reliance on unwanted squad players. Targeted high-value additions; immediate tactical integration across all phases. Recruitment strategies dictates long-term performance ceiling in top-four race.
Officiating Governance Victim of subjective offside interpretation surrounding non-contact interference. Beneficiary of VAR forensic paralysis on non-contact interference calls. Pro-Ref (PGMOL) apology underlines systemic flaws in video officiating logic.

2. Context & Background: The Landscape Leading to This Conversation

To understand the intensity of the debate on Football Social Daily, one must examine the broader structural landscape defining both Manchester clubs at this juncture. Manchester United entered the derby seeking validation for an executive restructuring under INEOS and manager Michael Carrick. The summer narrative presented to supporters emphasized prudent financial management, avoiding inflated transfer fees while adding squad volume. However, early-season metrics revealed an alarming defensive instability, with United conceding approximately two goals per game and struggling to establish sustained territorial control against established Premier League opposition.

Conversely, Manchester City arrived at Old Trafford navigating the post-Pep Guardiola transition under Enzo Maresca. While skepticism naturally accompanied the arrival of a new managerial regime, City’s squad rebuild prioritized elite physical and technical profiles capable of sustaining dominance across multiple fronts. The integration of Elliot Anderson into City’s engine room provided immediate defensive solidity and ball-winning dynamism, offering a sharp contrast to United's unrefined central midfield structure.

Concurrently, the broader Premier League landscape has been shaped by mounting frustration over officiating standards. The Professional Game Match Officials Limited (PGMOL)—rebranded this season as "Pro-Ref" in an effort to distance itself from recurring controversies—faced immediate scrutiny following high-profile VAR failures. The intersection of tactical frustration, squad construction fallacies, and refereeing ambiguity created an explosive backdrop for the derby debrief.

3. Deep-Dive Thematic Breakdown

3.1 The Paradox of Man-Advantage: Tactical Impotence and the Counter-Attack Trap

The defining tactical talking point of the match was Manchester United's complete inability to capitalize on Phil Foden’s twentieth-minute red card. Historically, United’s most successful derby performances over the past decade—dating back to the tenure of Ole Gunnar Solskjaer—were built upon a sharp, vertical counter-attacking model. By ceding possession and exploiting the space left behind City’s high defensive line, United routinely executed lethal transitions through rapid wingers.

Foden's dismissal inverted this dynamic. Forced down to ten men, Maresca instructed City to retreat into a compact, low-to-mid defensive block. This adjustment effectively eliminated the open grass United required to execute their transition patterns. Confronted with the onus of breaking down an organized block, United’s tactical deficiencies were laid bare. The side lacked basic positional play principles: there were no inner-half-space overloads, no dynamic third-man runs to pull City's center-backs out of position, and no qualitative width capable of beating defenders one-on-one.

"The red card was redundant. It actually made it more of an advantage for Man City because whenever Man United have ever got an advantage over City over the last 10 years, it's counter-attack. The minute that they went down to 10 men, the United game plan went out of the window." — Joel Tudor

Despite possessing an array of attacking talent on the pitch—including Bruno Fernandes, Bryan Mbeumo, Matheus Cunha, Kobbie Mainoo, and substitute Benjamin Sesko—United failed to create a single high-value scoring opportunity. Joel Tudor emphasized that the red card actually worked to City's strategic benefit, transforming what could have been an open, end-to-end contest into a controlled defensive exercise tailored to City’s technical resilience.

3.2 Carrington's Structural Malady: Squad Construction, Summer Missteps, and the Rashford Anomaly

The panel's critique extended deep into Carrington's recruitment hierarchy, questioning the fundamental philosophy governing United's summer transfers. Executive figures had lauded the additions of Youri Tielemans for £35 million and Andrey Santos for £50 million as "smart, value-driven business." However, pitch performance has contradicted this narrative. Neither player has provided the physical presence, defensive coverage, or press resistance required to anchor a top-tier Premier League midfield.

The defensive perimeter further highlighted these recruitment oversights. Fullbacks Diogo Dalot and Patrick Dorgu were repeatedly run ragged by City's ten-man setup, failing to provide defensive stability or meaningful offensive width. Tudor noted that compromising on player profiles to save capital ultimately degrades the overall standard of the starting eleven. When benchmarked against City’s targeted recruitment, United's squad assembly appears reactionary and lacking clear tactical alignment.

"That is my exact evidence of what went wrong during the summer time. Didn't upgrade on the defense, both [Dalot and Dorgu] have got run ragged the entire game at 10 men." — Joel Tudor

Nothing illustrates this structural dissonance more clearly than the situation surrounding Marcus Rashford. Having been actively marketed for a transfer throughout the summer window as part of a planned squad overhaul, Rashford nevertheless lined up as the starting left-winger in the derby. Analyst Marley Anderson identified this dependency on an unwanted asset as undeniable proof of a deeper systemic malady.

"The fact that Marcus Rashford is now starting left-winger is a problem. He wasn't part of the planned next year for this season and that was a starting-winger. That's your evidence of the problem which is way deeper than the surface." — Marley Anderson

Drawing parallels to Aston Villa—where Unai Emery was forced to deploy Tammy Abraham after hooking Nicholas Jackson at halftime—the panel highlighted how Premier League clubs frequently suffer when long-term squad planning collapses, forcing managers to rely on players previously deemed surplus to requirements.

3.3 The Forensic Fallacy of VAR: Pro-Ref, Non-Contact Offside, and Rules-Engine Pathology

The officiating debrief centered on City’s controversial goal involving Erling Haaland and Enzo Fernandez. Fernandez, positioned significantly beyond the last defender in an offside position, launched himself horizontally across the six-yard box to make a play for the incoming cross. Although Fernandez failed to make physical contact with the ball, his explosive movement directly altered the positioning of United defender Lisandro Martinez and restricted keeper coverage before Haaland converted at the far post.

"Enzo Fernandez is in that offside position in the middle, throws himself at the ball, makes a play for the ball. Now, because he doesn't touch the ball, technically, the offside rule becomes subjective, which I don't understand that at all." — Nile McCorn

Under current PGMOL (Pro-Ref) guidelines, because Fernandez did not physically touch the ball, the determination of offside shifted from an objective geometric decision to a subjective assessment of "interfering with play." The VAR team ultimately allowed the goal to stand, prompting a subsequent public admission of error and apology from Pro-Ref governance. Nile McCorn expressed total bewilderment at this logical construct, arguing that any attacking player actively attempting to head a cross inside the six-yard box is inherently interfering with the defensive phase of play.

Marley Anderson delivered a scathing diagnostic of the VAR protocol, describing it as "hyper-forensic paralysis." By zooming in to inspect microscopic hair-touches and frame-by-frame contact, video officials lose sight of the obvious spatial reality staring them in the face—the "elephant in the room."

"It's just so forensic, isn't it? You know, I think they're so afraid of missing something big that the obvious elephant in the room is staring them right in the face and they can't see it." — Marley Anderson

This mechanical reliance on strict physical contact thresholds over common-sense spatial analysis continues to undermine the credibility of match officiating across the league.

3.4 The Midfield Paradigm Shift: Elliot Anderson's Dominance vs. Kobbie Mainoo's Stagnation

In stark contrast to United's central midfield struggles, City’s Elliot Anderson delivered a masterclass in modern midfield engine-room play. Operating down a man for seventy minutes, Anderson single-handedly controlled the tempo of the derby. He disrupted United's build-up attempts, won secondary duels, and executed precise vertical passes to relieve pressure on City's backline.

The direct confrontation between Elliot Anderson and United youngster Kobbie Mainoo provided a telling analytical contrast. Around the seventy-minute mark, Anderson dispossessed Mainoo with effortless physicality before initiating a clean transition forward. Anderson framed this moment as a clear demonstration of the gap between media hype and established world-class performance. While Mainoo remains a promising talent, his current physical and positional profile falls short when matched against powerhouses like Anderson or Declan Rice.

The panel noted that Anderson offers a dynamic blend of Rodri-like positional control combined with explosive box-to-box duel winning. His performance reinforced the principle that elite midfields are built on physical dominance and rapid decision-making, qualities United currently lack in their central pivot.

3.5 The Title Race Architecture: Arsenal, Maresca's City, and the Consistency Metric

Looking at the macro Premier League landscape, Joel Tudor asserted that the title race storyline has already crystallized into a direct dual-monopoly between Arsenal and Manchester City. Both clubs have demonstrated exceptional statistical consistency, maintaining superior goal differentials and robust defensive records that separate them from the rest of the division.

"Both scored, ones conceded, one's conceded, the goal difference is far and wide ahead of majority of other teams. That's the story of the season already. We've already got our storyline. Arsenal and Man City, final week of May, who's gonna win it?" — Joel Tudor

The panel highlighted how elite goalkeeping and defensive resilience decide tight title races, citing David Raya’s game-saving penalty stop for Arsenal against Newcastle as a prime example of individual quality securing vital points. For Manchester City, the true test under Enzo Maresca will not be a single fixture, but their capacity to sustain long winning runs during dense winter scheduling.

With upcoming fixtures against Liverpool and Paris Saint-Germain in the Champions League, alongside domestic encounters against Sunderland and Norwich City in the Carabao Cup, City's squad depth will undergo rigorous testing. How Maresca's side responds to inevitable setbacks will dictate whether they can match the relentless consistency of Pep Guardiola's historic title-winning machinery.

3.6 The Managerial Paradox: The Permanent Temporary Manager Phenomenon

Nile McCorn introduced a provocative structural concept regarding Manchester United’s managerial carousel: the "Permanent Temporary Manager" paradox. Historically, United have experienced immediate surges in performance under interim leadership—as seen during the initial caretaker stints of Ole Gunnar Solskjaer, Ruud van Nistelrooy, and Michael Carrick. During these interim periods, tactical clarity and psychological freedom often yield impressive results against elite opposition.

"The more this goes on with Man United, it feels to me like maybe they'd just be better off having a permanent temporary manager. Aside from Rangnick, they always seem to play better when there's an interim manager in charge." — Nile McCorn

However, the moment these caretaker appointments are formalized into permanent contracts, performance levels routinely regress. Excepting Ralf Rangnick's troubled tenure, the pressure of long-term structural building appears to paralyze United's coaching staff. The panel questioned whether the operational culture at Old Trafford creates an environment where managers thrive only when operating free from the weight of long-term executive expectations.

4. Speaker Perspectives & Analytical Contrast

The dynamic on Football Social Daily derived much of its authority from the stark analytical contrasts between its three contributors. Each speaker approached the post-derby evaluation from a distinct perspective, revealing key areas of consensus and sharp friction.

Nile McCorn functioned as the analytical facilitator and governance critic. His focus centered on the logical absurdities of the rule book, particularly regarding Pro-Ref’s offside interpretation. McCorn repeatedly pressed his colleagues on the breakdown of refereeing standards, demanding structural accountability for subjective VAR decisions while exploring macro trends like the interim manager phenomenon.

Joel Tudor provided the unvarnished, pragmatic perspective of an exasperated Manchester United insider. Tudor completely dismissed refereeing excuses, maintaining that United’s performance was so fundamentally flawed that officiating decisions were entirely irrelevant to the outcome. His primary focus remained on recruitment accountability, calling out executive penny-pinching and questioning the long-term viability of United's current squad assembly.

Marley Anderson offered detailed tactical and player-level critiques. Anderson focused on individual duels, spotlighting Elliot Anderson's physical dominance over Kobbie Mainoo as a benchmark for elite Premier League performance. Furthermore, Anderson delivered the podcast’s most acute media critique, calling out the forensic myopia of VAR officials who miss obvious structural fouls while searching for microscopic contact.

Speaker Primary Analytical Lens Key Stance on Derby Outcome Officiating & VAR Perspective
Nile McCorn Governance & Rule Mechanics Derby highlighted systemic managerial and refereeing failure across the league. Offside rule logic is fundamentally broken; non-contact interference must be objective.
Joel Tudor Recruitment & Tactical Execution United's performance was abysmal; red card paradox proved United cannot break down blocks. Dismissed VAR impact entirely; United could have played 10 days without scoring.
Marley Anderson Individual Duels & Video Analysis Elliot Anderson's midfield masterclass exposed United's squad construction flaws. VAR suffers from forensic paralysis; inspecting hair-touches while missing obvious spatial fouls.

5. Strategic & Industry Implications

The observations articulated during this episode carry profound implications for football analytics, recruitment strategy, and match governance across the modern game:

1. The Demise of Unidimensional Transition Models: Modern Premier League tactics have evolved past pure counter-attacking systems. Teams aspiring to challenge for major honors must possess structured positional play frameworks capable of dismantling low defensive blocks. Manchester United's failure against ten men demonstrates that transition-heavy setups have a strict ceiling in elite competition.

2. The High Cost of Volume Recruitment: Spending significant capital on mid-tier squad volume—exemplified by United's acquisitions of Tielemans and Santos—fails to elevate a club's competitive ceiling. True structural progress requires targeted investment in world-class profiles like Elliot Anderson who possess both physical dominance and technical command under pressure.

3. Institutional Failures in Refereeing Rebrands: Rebranding PGMOL to Pro-Ref has failed to resolve systemic officiating issues. As long as VAR protocols prioritize microscopic physical contact over obvious spatial and psychological interference, refereeing bodies will continue to issue post-match apologies rather than delivering on-field accuracy.

6. Looking Ahead: Unresolved Questions & Next Milestones

As the Premier League season unfolds, several critical metrics and milestones will determine whether the structural issues highlighted on Football Social Daily are addressed or exacerbated:

  • Manchester United's Positional xG: Can Michael Carrick introduce structured positional build-up patterns to improve expected goals against mid-to-low defensive blocks?
  • Kobbie Mainoo's Physical Progression: How will United manage Mainoo's development to bridge the physical gap exposed by elite midfielders like Elliot Anderson?
  • City's Fixture Congestion Test: Will Enzo Maresca's side maintain tactical consistency during an intense stretch against Liverpool, PSG, and domestic cup opponents?
  • Pro-Ref Rule Reformulation: Will IFAB and Pro-Ref revise the offside protocol to automatically classify active, non-contact aerial attempts in the six-yard box as objective interference?
  • Carrington's Winter Transfer Strategy: Will INEOS leadership abandon volume-based recruitment in favor of elite defensive and midfield targets during the upcoming window?

💬 Key Quotes & Speaker Breakdown

Manchester United performance

"We could have played that game for another 10 days and we wouldn't have scored."

— Joel Tudor

Refereeing controversy

"Enzo Fernandez is in that offside position in the middle, throws himself at the ball, makes a play for the ball. Now, because he doesn't touch the ball, technically, the offside rule becomes subjective, which I don't understand that at all."

— Nile McCorn

"The Foden one was a red card. Anyone who wants to argue that can kind of get to, to be honest, because he kicks out in his arms. If you kick out at someone, you're off, that's it."

— Marley Anderson

Premier League title race

"Both scored, ones conceded, one's conceded, the goal difference is far and wide ahead of majority of other teams. That's the story of the season already. We've already got our storyline. Arsenal and Man City, final week of May, who's gonna win it?"

— Joel Tudor

Tactical analysis

"The red card was redundant. It actually made it more of an advantage for Man City because whenever Man United have ever got an advantage over City over the last 10 years, it's counter-attack. The minute that they went down to 10 men, the United game plan went out of the window."

— Joel Tudor

Manchester United management

"The more this goes on with Man United, it feels to me like maybe they'd just be better off having a permanent temporary manager. Aside from Rangnick, they always seem to play better when there's an interim manager in charge."

— Nile McCorn

Manchester United transfer strategy

"That is my exact evidence of what went wrong during the summer time. Didn't upgrade on the defense, both [Dalot and Dorgu] have got run ragged the entire game at 10 men."

— Joel Tudor

Marcus Rashford form

"The fact that Marcus Rashford is now starting left-winger is a problem. He wasn't part of the planned next year for this season and that was a starting-winger. That's your evidence of the problem which is way deeper than the surface."

— Marley Anderson

VAR officiating

"It's just so forensic, isn't it? You know, I think they're so afraid of missing something big that the obvious elephant in the room is staring them right in the face and they can't see it."

— Marley Anderson

Player form

"Elliot Anderson... he ran that game, it was ridiculous. He's probably the best player in the world on current form, I would say."

— Marley Anderson
📜 View Full Episode Verbatim Transcript 31,645 characters
This is Football Social Daily, Premier League Podcast. In the words of John Mackinro, V-A-R-U-Series, the Manchester Derby serving up a fresh slice of referee and controversy with two huge decisions. The United had the advantage, but it was game set and match to city, but where's the baseline for officiating incompetence. Jucia talking points, then a punnet of straw-reason cream on today's Football Social Daily. My name's Nile McCorn, joined by the doubles duo of Marley Anderson and Joel Tudor today. Good morning, boys. Good morning. For a man who hits tennis, there was a lot of tennis puns in there. It's been a while since I've done a punny intro on Football Social Daily. I thought you'd been watching the US Open Finals over the weekend, and you'd just got carried away. All right, by tennis. There's no way I'd be watching that. I'll tell you this is great. Marley, you're going to hate me for this. I hate you anyway, but go on. OK, well, you're going to hate me more then. Oh, I don't see it. Paddle. Oh, no. He's joined the Marley. He's joined the dark side. Do you know what? We lost a fall in soldier there. Do you know what the most annoying thing is about that? You sort of give the vibe of a paddle player. And I thought it's good that he gives the vibe of a paddle player. The paddle player. And that's more disrespectful. No. I haven't played yet. I might hate it. I might hate it. I might hate it. Well, you've still got the chance. It's like a sliding doors moment in history. You very rarely get to see those sliding doors moments. You do, don't go to paddle. You're already enough of a wanker. You're a nice level of wanker. You'll go across the, across the, like, you'll never come back from this now if you've become a paddle wanker. Can't stand it. If I treat paddle the same way I treat golf, which is a love-hate relationship, where there are times I love playing golf, and there are other times where it's the least enjoyable thing I can think of on the planet. Like, why would I want to go and play golf? It's one of those sports where it is so frustrating. I don't know where the paddle is going to quite have that same effect on me, but we'll find out. Ignor. It can't, because paddles easy. Paddles are dumbed down version of tennis for people who can't be asked to play tennis because it's too hard. Like, golf is hard. So if it was, it was like an idiot version of golf that people play, then I would do the golf. Yeah, there you go. That's why no one watches the mini golf world championships because it's just an idiot version of proper golf, which is hard. Well, that's too hard for me. It's like pool and snooker. I got no respect for any pool players because the pockets, the size of buckets, and you wear a glove. Nail, if you mentioned that you're doing high rocks as well, I think me and Marley might have to undemocratically oust you out of the podcast. Oh, mate. You know what I'm like. There's no way I'll be able to survive the high rocks. You're just going to be doing that quarter leg, guys. No, you're rocks. The build. If it was drink a pint between each exercise, rather than run a kilometre, I think I'd be well up for it, but the running in between exercises. I just wish people were more original with what they do recreationally. It feels like everyone just goes down the same aisle, though. Well, I think it's not just because paddle's easier than tennis, Marley, but because it's a lot shorter, it's quicker to complete a game and people are impatient. It's not hard. It's not as hard. No, it's not. It's not as strenuous as tennis. It doesn't require you to win. No, I never claimed it was. I'm not defending paddle. I've never played it, but it's just quicker, isn't it? It's like, oh, I'm crap. I'm crap at tennis, and I've got no attentions by what can I do. Well, get a life. Stop doing paddle. Don't even think about paddle. Let's get back to the proper sport show with. Well, I thought you'd be quite keen to avoid it, Joel. Considering Manchester United, we're absolutely abysmal yesterday. For over the adjectives, keep going now. I don't think there's enough. Honestly, I know you said last week that you were worried about the Manchester Derby. Where do you want to start? Do we want to discuss the red card situation with Phil Foden? Or do we just want to cut straight to the chase and say United had a man's advantage for 70 minutes and did nothing with it? Honestly, Nile, those incidents, they're the city goal or not goal, whatever you want to cut, it shouldn't have been allowed anyway. And the red card, I genuinely don't care. I don't know why so many United fans are so adamant on how these decisions impacted the game or it shouldn't have been, shouldn't have been, it would have taken away three points. We could have played that game for another 10 days and we wouldn't have scored. But why, though, why is that how can a team with the quality and the attacking players that Manchester United had on the pitch and Burmo, Fernandez, Cunya, all good players in their own right? They couldn't create a thing. Marcus Rashford was on the pitch, Coby Manu was on the pitch. All of these creative players, Cesco came off the bench. Nothing, absolutely nothing. Why? It was embarrassing, you know, as soon as Folding got sent off, I didn't even celebrate, I didn't have an ounce of euphoria going through my body because I knew that this Manu United team can't break down a team. If Manu United require going up against the team that's going to sit back a little bit, it's almost redundant. The red card was redundant. It actually made it more of an advantage from Man City because whenever Manu United have ever got an advantage over the city over the last 10 years, it's counterattack. The minute that they went down to 10 men, the United Game Club went out of the window, they had no ideas, they didn't know what to do through the midfield. It's been that way since Solshar, though. Solshar built the foundations of his United team on counter-attack in football to decent success. United finished second, they reached the Europa League final. When we went through the transfer window and I hate to say I told you so and I really hope things change around during this season. But the window that we've just had, I feel like it's coming home to roost a lot now, where when the rhetoric around it was smart signings, 35 million for tealiments, 50 million for Andre Santos, great, really smart, saved money. You go and look at Anderson yesterday and you think he's worth both of those. You ran the game at 10 men. That's exactly what I was saying during the summer time. It's not about your quantity of plays, it's about getting the right quality and if you need to pay the price for the right profile player, you pay it because it will change your team. You looked at those fallbacks yesterday, Dallow and Dorgu. That is my exact evidence of what went wrong during the summer time. Didn't upgrade on the defense, both have got run ragged the entire game at 10 men. That is evidence in plain sight right in front for everyone to see of how poor that summer was because now we average in about considering two goals a game. It's not good enough. We're likely to concede two goals every single game. How is that good enough for a man United team and everyone wants to say it was a smart summer? The chickens are going to come home to roost. I'm telling you, when it comes to this summer and everyone was talking about how penny-pinching and really back in the in your strategy for me I don't buy it, the jaw is out for me and it always will be until we see some kind of quality. Don't get me wrong, Michael Carrick definitely should have had a bit of criticism for yesterday. But look at this Nile, the fact that Marcus Rashford is now starting left-winger is a problem. He was getting marketed out for the entire summer time. He wasn't part of the planned next year for this season and that was a starting-winger. That's your evidence of the problem which is way deeper than the surface. He shouldn't be a starting-winger. But I think we're seeing that across the Premier League I was at Estonville against Nottingham Forest at the weekend and Tammy Abraham came on for Nicholas Jackson who was hooked at half time. Nicholas Jackson, you know, the star striker signing to replace Ollie Watkins. Tammy Abraham was being given an exit route from Estonville in the summer and when Brian Majos fit, he'll be third choice for Estonville and yet he comes on at half time because Unai Emery's got no options and you go all of a sudden from a player who's being shoot out the door to get me a goal and that can be problematic, I think. You've seen players that are being given an escape route and then all of a sudden they stay and then what's the mentality, what's the dynamic like there when all of a sudden the manager goes, come on, do something. Yeah, they're getting resurrected and thinking it's like a new signing, isn't it? It's like that cliche of new signing when he's not a new signing. There's a reason he went out on loan twice, consecutive seasons rush. I don't want to put all the blame on Rashford but I'm saying this is the evidence of what's going wrong at Man United right now where we're relying on players from the past that probably should have been moved on a long time ago to now make a difference and it's unfair on them because they're probably not of the required quality but that's not just for Rashford. I mean, Burma looked a shadow of the player who was last season. Cuneradote nearly, he's not really getting kickstarted. Zesco should have came on way sooner in the game yesterday. So when you look at the team, Man City's team versus Man United's team, one massive goal for quality, Man City paid a lot but they also received a lot in the summer but we had one signing starting. Go and look at every rival of ours. They've got about three or four new signings in the team they're making a difference. How can we rely on a 29 year old, okay, 29 year old Telia Man's who has come in and is expected to be the guy who makes the difference. You can't, the expectations are ridiculous for that kind of thing. You need quality in the team to kick us on. We're basically playing with the same team as last year. You're telling me that's gonna kick Man United on into potentially challenging for the title. It's not gonna happen. So everyone keeps defending the strategy. I don't buy it for one second. Hopefully Carlos Belieber can be our night in shining armor but the kids 21 years old. I don't put too much emphasis on him coming in and changing the entire team. But honestly now that when you talk about, you can talk about the decisions between us. I really am not interested in them because we could have played that game until the cows come home and we would not have scored genuinely. I don't disagree. I don't think Man United deserved anything from the game. The more this goes on with Man United, it feels to me, like maybe they'd just be better off having a permanent temporary manager, if you know what I mean. Aside from Ragnic, they always seem to play better when there's an interim manager in charge, Rude Van History, Michael Carrick. As soon as that person becomes permanent, it just all falls to bits, look what happens as SoulShark, exactly the same thing. You know, I was excellent as the interim manager, got the job on a full-time basis, sacked. So I don't know what it is with that club but it just seems to keep happening. It does, yeah, I mean, we're staring at, sort of, it's not quite staring at the face but it's come into light, isn't it? Like, it's night and day between last season and this season. And the only thing that's changed is he's got a permanent contract and everyone's gone, well, we know what's gonna happen in the summer. You know, we know what he does. There's nothing new, nothing fresh about the teams or they're probably just sort of going through the motions and they were never really in that game again, city, I never expected them to score, city were fairly comfortable, even when they went down to 10 men. I think the final possession starts with 55, 45 to man United. And that's like, that's telling really because you still, they're still having a fair bit of the ball even though they've got 10 men, they're still good enough to keep it off you for a bit. So if they're at 11, it'd probably be 65, 35 in favour of a city. But instead, they adapted really well. And obviously took their chance when it came, even though it was controversial and all the rest of it, but I thought the referees, the whole game was a bit of stinker from the official's point of view. Let's talk about the decisions even though Joel doesn't want to begin with the first one, the red card for Phil Foden. I think it's a red card for Phil Foden. He kicks Bruno in the bollocks, reacts. The reason Foden reacts is because Bruno Fernandez fouls him and then when Foden is led on top of the ball, Fernandez tries to poke the ball from underneath him and just... It's almost like Hassard and Swansea City ball boy type, wasn't it, which tries to chip the ball underneath him? Yeah, he boots him in the bottom of the back, right? And Foden reacts to that. And the referees saw it, Michael Oliver, and immediately was in no doubt that it was a red card offence. Bruno Fernandez kicking Phil Foden, I don't know. Should it have been two red cards? Do you agree with the decision? Give us your thoughts, boys. Yeah, the Foden one was a red card. I mean, anyone who wants to argue that can kind of get to what, to be honest, because he kicks out in his arms like the Diogas. Diogas, he's like the Diagos Simioni and David Beckham one was in it. If you kick out of someone, you're off, that's it. I don't know what he had arguments about. I think his argument was that Bruno has kicked him in the back, like you say, it was lit, yeah, which he did. Honestly, it was lit like the hazard Swansea City ball boy one was trying to. So what should have happened to Bruno then, Joel? What should have happened to Bruno? Cause he kicks him in the back and gets away with it. How does that happen? How does that happen? If you would have put it to Michael Oliver, he might have done something crazy, because he couldn't get any decision right yesterday, especially with the goal. So I don't know, maybe a yellow card, but at least it's not like he's gone to boot him in the mid-drift, where the ball isn't like Foden's done. I think the key difference is the fact that the ball is in the vicinity when Bruno Fernandez kicks Foden in the back. When Foden kicks Fernandez, it's not ambiguous, is it? Well, he's only two balls. Just kicks him in the gut. The ball was in the vicinity when Axel Doesasi halved someone in the Crystal Palace game at the weekend, but he missed him and he got sent off for it. So, you know, do you think Bruno Fernandez should have been red-cardded then? I think he should have been at least booked. No, I agree with that. And I also think that little rat bastard sent a back you've got should have been booked as well, for going in and just trying to start a fight for no reason. The butcher, the mid-jit butcher you've got at the back. Start a fight with who? Foden, I think it was, when he was, he came in because he pushed it. No, he came running over and started to try to push him and I was like, what's going on here? You've, honestly, Fodenandez, what would people do that? Like, what are you fighting for? The situations between you. Let me find a clip of any new castle player pushing an opposition when the decision goes that way. It's only because it was a straight red card and you see players do this all the time when there's a bad challenge that goes in and someone gets straight red carded, all of a sudden, it's, oh, how dare you challenge our player like that and they all go, guns are blazing towards the player who's committed the challenge, whether it's a red card or not a red card, is then for people to make their own minds up. But I hate that. It's just one of those things in modern football and I don't like it either, Marley, to be honest with you. So, I take it, you didn't like Harry Maguire throw it and then the fans of bananas on the floor for diving. No, that's fine because he's Argentinian, so I'll screw him. But no, I think, look, I think it should be yellow for Bruno Fernandez and I understand that on, like, in the game we have now, it's a red card because he kicks you in the gut. I also think that it's not that violent, it's not that, it's not gonna hurt much. So I don't, I have no problem with those types of things where it's clearly like a reaction to something that's happened to you and not uncalled for it. It's not come out of the blue with, there's a reason why he kicks out. I'm happy with that being a yellow for both players. I don't think Foden kicking, he's not endangered him really, Azzi. He's not gonna, he hasn't kicked him with enough force to break his ankle law, kick his bollocks off, so he never has kids. You know what I mean? It's like, it's just a barely, barely touched, isn't really. I just think it, but the rule is that it's a red, that's fine, it's the rule I've got an issue with, like, is he endangered in an opponent? That's what Gary Neville said on commentary, said, if you're gonna get sent off for kicking out at an opponent, you may as well fucking give him something. You know what I mean? I actually don't disagree, I think Bruno should have at least got booked. If it was gonna be a red card for Bruno Fernandez, I don't think it should have been a straight red. I think he could easily have got two yellows, one for the initial foul on Foden, which is a rubbish tackle on the touch line. And the second one for kicking him in the back. So it would have been two yellows and a red subsequently from that, as it happens, Foden dismissed, I don't think we can disagree with the Foden red card. Maybe the lack of punishment for Bruno Fernandez is whether referees fell down, but they fell down quite significantly, it seems like, with the offside decision that wasn't given. We'll talk about that in more detail after this. The controversy comes, even though it's tight for Erling Harland being onside, which is just, he's being played on by Patrick Dorgu's outstretched toe. Enzo Fernandez in the centre, who makes a play for the ball, trying to diving header it, misses the ball. He's being marshaled by Martinez. It then falls to Harland, who puts the ball into the back of the net. So we've established that Harland is in an onside, and he's been playing for the ball for a long time. And who puts the ball into the back of the net. So we've established that Harland is in an onside position, just the technology's cleared that up. So it's nothing to do with Harland. The debate comes with Enzo Fernandez, who is in that offside position in the middle, throws himself at the ball, makes a play for the ball. Now, because he doesn't touch the ball, technically, the offside rule becomes subjective, which I don't understand that at all, because it just leaves so much room for ambiguity when it comes to decision making. However, PGMOL, which is now called pro-reth, they've changed their name this season, probably to try and change their reputation of continuously making poor decisions. They've said that they own Manchester United in apology, because Enzo Fernandez was probably into fearing with play because he impacts directly the next action, which is what Martinez does and what Harland eventually does, which is put the ball in the net. We've had our sale on the red card. What do we think about the goal? I think it's a perfectly good goal. Not my jockey. It was annoying me how long it was taking going level to realise what was going on in commentary. That's the thing. Like, screaming at the screen, like, my friend, you know, I see what's going on in front of you. Yeah, it was that thing where I just thought, right, okay, maybe people who played their entire career for money night, it shouldn't be on the money night. Man City Derby, you know what I mean? Like, because he's just refusing to see what was going on. The camera angle in fairness to Neville was from behind where the line would be. So perspective always makes it difficult to tell. But then again, it was quite clear and obvious to use that ironic turn of phrase. The Enzo Fernandez was miles offside in the middle. It's one of the things, isn't it? It's like, again, it's the rule of should somebody be standing standing in an offside position? Like, how do you judge them to be interfering with the game? And should you care if they don't, if they don't interfere in the game? The bit I don't understand is he's not touched the ball. So therefore it's subjective. That's just nonsense, isn't it? He's tried to score a goal. So therefore he is interfering with the play. He's tried to score a goal. If the ball's up the other end, right? And Manchester City are defending, not attacking. And Erling Harland has stood 50 yards offside. That's not interfering with play because the play's up the other end. When the ball's being crossed into the box and a player is actively trying to score a header, which is what Fernandez is doing. How is that not interfering with play? And if it isn't interfering with play because he hasn't touched it, how does that then become subjective? It's the most obvious error I've seen in a long time because if Enzo Fernandez is not there, Martinez completely changed his position and he probably sees Harland behind him. He's probably able to clear it away. Because let's not forget as well, in this same instance, when a player is influencing play by being in front of a goalkeeper and they're in an offside position, they don't have to touch it. But if they're influencing the way in which the goalkeeper moves or he can't see the ball, that's offside. So it's the exact same instance. But even though Fernandez doesn't touch the ball, the next action in the game is Harland scoring a goal. Yes, how does that influence it? It's insane. Exactly. That's why the apologies come out this morning. I mean, it's a shame we can't cash in apologies for points, but that's where we are, isn't it? It's crazy. It's like Marty and I said at the end of the game, you've got about eight different people watching the same clip apparently qualified and they still deem it as absolutely fine. Well, is it like a case of group think, whether or just kind of a herd of sheep following each other's order or something, is no one allowed to think objectively or look at the rules and I don't get where they've come to that decision to be honest, it's quite strange. It's just so forensic, isn't it? You know, I think they're so afraid of missing something big that the obvious elephant in the room is staring them right in the face and they can't see it. It's just common sense. There's a player in an off-side position throwing himself at the ball. That is interfering with play. And then you could see on the recording where they're trying to like see if there's a touch on the head and I'm thinking, but he's dying towards it. I don't understand why you're looking for an actual cut. Even if it so, if it brushed his hair like you need in touch, that's interfering then. But the fact that he's giving the act to go for it when he's about five yards offside isn't, I don't know, I don't know, it's crazy. We've spoken a lot about the poor referee in performance. We've spoken a lot about the poor Manchester United performance. Have to praise Manchester City, Marley, because that is a huge result for them, not just because it's a Manchester Derby win, but also new manager, down to 10 men, pretty much a new group of players, especially in that midfield. It's a brand new midfield, a huge result for them. It is, yeah. I think it's an entirely new midfield, but you've got an entire midfield in Elliot Anderson because the guy is ridiculous. What, like, he ran that game, it was ridiculous. Everywhere he was. Ridiculous said, I remember, Brad, probably about 70 minutes in or something, he sort of, Manu was doing something with the ball and Anderson just went up and took it off him and just passed it nice and simple. And I just thought it takes me back three months when everyone was doing the ridiculous thing in the World Cup of, oh, a copy of Manu needs minutes. Why isn't copy of Manu playing? He's not as good as the lad in front of him. It's that simple. He's not as good as Anderson. He's not as good as Rice. So he sits on the bench. That's it. And it was just, it was like, many against boys, it was like an older brother taking the ball off his younger brother. Like, just, I love that. You piss off over there, I'm having this now. You're gonna play with your friends and it was like just a level of performance, which I don't even think Rodry would give you that type of the same performance. He controls the game. Anderson goes and wins you the ball and then controls the game. And it's slightly different and I'm glad he's, he's hitting the heights. It hurts every time I see him play performance like that because he should never have left us, but it is what it is. And he's at the top of his game now and he's probably the best player in the world on current form, I would say. The Manchester Derby has always looked at as one of the bigger games in the calendar because it is, but in terms of the real test for Manchester City, are they gonna get more of a test off of Liverpool? Certainly gonna get more of a test off of PSG. Is that gonna be the real indication of where this City team are at? Or was yesterday enough evidence to suggest that they are gonna be the real deal again this season, despite Pep's departure, despite all of the changes in personnel? I think the real test for City is not necessarily one fixture. I think for me, it's more a case that can they develop the same kind of consistency that we know we knew them to be under Pep, but I think that's purely it because we didn't know what kind of style they would be when Maraska came in, we didn't know if they would take to his ideas because we've all seen when a big manager leaves a club and he has such a strong identity and someone has to come and fill his boots, do the players take to it? How long is it gonna take? But then when you look at the league table, Arsenal and Man City, they're literally locked into what the story of the season's gonna be. Both scored a one's conceded, one's conceded to goal difference is far and wide ahead of majority of other teams. That's the story of the season already. We've already got our storyline. Arsenal and Man City, final week of May, who's gonna win it? That's literally it. So I think it's more a case of who can be more consistent again, who's gonna get that 10 game unbeaten win streak in February and these kinds of things. One game will never define these two teams because they're just too consistent. I said this last week and I'll say it again, I think the true test for Man City is when they lose a game whenever that might be. Had they lost yesterday, they've got a lovely game to try and bounce back on Thursday, Norwich at home in the Carabell Cup and then Sunderland at home that the week end in the Premier League two lovely games if you lose the Manchester Derby to try and get back on track. However, let's say they do lose to Sunderland at the Etihad and that's their first defeat at the season under Maresca. They've then got to go to Liverpool and play PSG in the Champions League and then all of a sudden do you lose two games, three games in a row? What happens? I think that's gonna be the true test of City under Maresca this season is when they lose, are they gonna bounce back immediately like the Pep Guardiola size used to or are they gonna go on a bit of a wobble? And as you said, Joel, a bit of a wobble in the Premier League these days if you don't win for two, three, four games, you're not gonna win the title because that's the fine margin so we're speaking about these days. Yeah, I think it's gonna be just a two-way battle again, isn't it? It seems like I know Chelsea kind of in the equation, but these two squads Arsenal and Man City, they've just got so much depth right now where even their second teams are probably good enough to challenge for the lead title, potentially go far in the Champions League, that it is purely a case of who's gonna have the longest, the most longevity this season because we saw it last season, the minute you slip up twice, so you lost it on the bounce, you're pretty much gonna be ruled out of going for the lead title because Arsenal are just so strong now when it comes to consistency and churning. I mean, look at Raya, I know we'll talk about the game against Sunlin, but David Raya, if anyone was talking about how his defence protects him, he's almost just eradicated that whole narrative. He won them the game. I don't know, Bruno Gamar has his goal was incredible, but that was a nil nil, wasn't it? That could have completely changed the game around and what an unbelievable penalty save that was, it wasn't just an easy, you know, dive to your left a little bit, yes, they actually fully reach out to get that pace. He won them the game, and that's the deciding factor for them. So yeah, he's got the most endurance between them is my real test for them both. You're not putting whole city in the mix then, are they not title contenders? I don't even know, I don't know what to say about those goals. Third in the table, eight points, Drew with Aston Villa, Drew with Chelsea, Beat Manchester United, in their first four games. They're in there. They're in there, hope for Europe, there we go. Bellumi and Oli McBernie, lead in the charge, and Newcastle will go above them if we beat Leeds tonight, so I'm looking forward to going on tomorrow when we beat Leeds 1-0 with a scrappy goal and seeing Newcastle in the title race. Well, you're in it until you're out of it. You're in it until you're out of it. Classic, a football social daily classic to finish on today's podcast. Remember this season, Get in the Sea, our special Monday feature has been shifted to a Tuesday, and it's got its own dedicated show. And I know Joel tried very hard today, not to say the words get in the sea after everything that happened at Old Trafford on Sunday, but he's done his very best and succeeded. And hopefully you can join us tomorrow as well for the latest episode of FSD, where we will be getting all of the annoyances from the weekend off of our chests. Hit subscribe or follow now wherever you listen to podcasts. And that way you won't miss it. But until then, from Joel Marley and myself, that's it for now. We'll speak to you soon.