The Mechanics of Control and the Myth of Transparency

This is The Guardian. Hello and welcome to The Guardian football weekly, asked on when the title decided at the Emirates 2-1 over Chelsea they deserved it. Kai Havett's beautiful dummy, setting up Martin Erdogan for the winner. Before that Havett had equalised with a bit of a p-roller, canceling out Morgan Roger Shin and grab a kick. It was a good game. The goal of the weekend unsurprisingly came from the right boot of Ainsley-Mateland Niles, who most of us had largely forgotten about until the 96 minute of Everton's game with Manchester United. Best game on Saturday at Craven Cottage, three goals from left wingback for Palace as they won three-two. Manchester City just beat Coventry a great Friday night for Alexander Ezek and a pretty good one for Cody Gackpo. And then lots of drawers, Bournemouth conceded late for the third game in a row at Newcastle. Sunland should have been a hundred nil up at Brentford, but at a settle for a point. Did VAR Rob Forest should spurs consider scoring a goal this season? Hull's unbeaten start continues and Bryant and Leeds draw one a piece. We'll do all that, answer your questions, and that's Dave Guardian football week, Clean. On the panel today, Barry Glenn Denny. Welcome. Hi, Max. Hello, Johnny Lu. Hello, Max. And welcome, Jordan Jarrett Bryant. Yo, yo, yo. Let's start. Yo, yo, yo. Indeed. With Arsenal 2, Chelsea 1, can we start, Johnny, with the Kai Havett's dummy? I thought they didn't make enough of it in Coventry. I just thought it was so beautiful to have that awareness when the game is moving around you. And to set out the winner, I just thought I'd like a moment for the Kai Havett's dummy. Yes, exactly. There are things that, I mean, in a game where everything can be logged and measured and metriced. This is something that just won't show up on any of that. And the nonchalance of it as well, you almost kind of, I don't know, you could have tapped on it over it a little bit. It was, it was a solace on the left and that, that move that we saw from the community shield as well where he sort of plays inside on his right, but an oldie god is waiting there at the edge of the area. And, but this time, there's like a, there's a third, almost like the, you know, there's a, it's like choreographed. It just totally wrongfuts the Chelsea defense. And, and yeah, that is, that was probably the moment of grace that I think the game deserved because it was a really good game. And, and it deserved that, that little moment of, of genius. But as were you entertained, we'll be talking about Arsenal and all the, what, what Arsenal we see this season. And I thought I did a pretty entertaining job yesterday. Yeah, I enjoyed it. Just on that Harvard Stomy, he had tried one previously, I think, and it didn't quite come off. I think he probably should have shot on that occasion. So it wasn't his first faint of the game. But I was impressed by Arsenal. I wasn't entertained by them. And Arsenal side with Martin Ortegaard purring in it is completely different animal to the Arsenal. I think we saw last season where for various reasons mainly because he was playing through pain most of the time or out. That's a different animal. I thought he was sensational yesterday. Harvard's is really good. California was good and they're doing interesting things with him playing him high up the pitch. I think the fact it went behind so early probably helped the game evolve as a spectacle. I thought Chelsea brought a fair bit to the party as well. And Javi Lanzel was gutted afterwards, not to have taken anything from the game. And I don't think it would have been a unfair result if they had got a draw. You know, they had chances. But Arsenal were, I think, the better side. Yeah, I think I agree with that totally. You know, Netta hits the post, doesn't he? I think that was at 1-1. You could be annoyed if you're a Chelsea or it's not agreed if you're a Chelsea fan. You could have perhaps deserved a point. But I think I was well. It's the best of that as well. I had that chance at the end. Brilliant save by Maria. Yeah. Yeah, it was. Can I challenge that? Yes. Can I challenge that? Because everyone I thought was a brilliant save as well. And then I looked at it a few more times. And it's a good save. But actually, it's not as in the corner as I think what I thirst for. And as David Reyes of brilliant keeper, I think most will agree probably the best keeper in the league. I think he should be saving that. I think there was a similar chance, similar save he made last year against Minter. I'd definitely remember that game as Brighton. I think it won save of the season. Very similar, but it was much more in the corner. Therefore, more impressive. I'm going to say that I think the save is slightly overrated. I hear that. I think Robertson, I think keeper saved that shot. But it was still a chance. It looked better than I think it actually was, wasn't it? Robert Sanchez probably saves that. More broadly, Jordan, three wins from three. And we all sort of thought it before the season started, but you do look like Arsenal do look like the most well-rounded team in the league by some distance, I think. They really do. And I think that's why it's also important that Arsenal won that game yesterday, because whilst their rivals are still bedding in new players, have new managers and trying to figure out how they go about challenging for the title this season, or it might be top four, Arsenal just who are set and have got there, do know what they're doing, do win these games. And what Arsenal needs to do is ensure that by the time the likes of Chelsea, Manchester City, Liverpool with new managers told them up and running, talk them if you want as well. Oh, you're all getting up and running and work out what they're doing. They look up in his February and Arsenal at nine points clear. Arsenal got to rack up those wins and really try and maximize the fact that they are a team that is set and do know what they're doing. So I think it was important that they did win this game. I thought it was a really good football game generally. I thought Chelsea, I think it was Barry was saying, contributed to what was a really good game of football. I think against the Green of the Caihavers comments. I thought he's general player was brilliant. And I thought his goal was very un-Caihavers. And I liked the fact that he kind of was a self-made goal, which is not something I think you often say about Caihavers. I thought he was, I thought he shaded the man in the match. I know Ode to God got it. He was brilliant, but I thought, have us just shaded it. But my big takeaway from Chelsea was that, I thought they had the best window of everybody. I thought they had a really good window, got in a key poet upgrade. They got the required in, who I think elevates the defence slightly. But actually, to finish the game with two right-backs in midfield, I thought actually kind of highlighted that maybe they didn't have the kind of window that I thought they wouldn't. I think Alonzo would work that out. But it's concerning for them that they're two best midfielders, probably Lavia and Kaiseido seem to have really big injury problems. And I know they haven't got Europe to rack up the games. So they might just have enough, but I thought that was quite concerning in the middle. They seemed so full the way they've spent. They seem so, so, so, so weak and poor. Johnny, you wrote an interesting piece the other week. Maybe it was this week about sort of mediocre midfields. Midfielders in the Premier League costing a lot of money. But on this game, I just thought it was quite interesting when you see that midfield of Rice, Urligard and Lewis Skelly. You see a midfield that work together and work well to get, you know, they're all individually very good. But I just thought, I wanted to do it. I thought that piece was really interesting because I hadn't really considered it. I just thought when all the midfielders are probably quite good. But there you do have an example of a three that work really nicely together. Yes, yeah, I mean, it's a big topic, but I think Arsenal's works really well. And not just that, but having, you know, Marino and Zubimendi almost as kind of closes. They come on late on and lock the game down. And having those really defined roles is I think what every club is almost striving for with the midfield. It's that thing about the blanket, which is, which doesn't quite cover your head or your toes. I think that's the problem that a lot of modern midfielders find or the clubs are trying to solve when you're buying that central midfielder is you want almost someone who could do pretty much everything on the pitch who is physical and can dribble out of trouble, but also, you know, provides a threat in the area but can also break up attacks. And that's how, you know, you're getting these massive amounts of money spent on. And, you know, I don't think, you know, players like Ellie Anderson or Enzo Fernandez are mediocre. I just think they'll be off, they'll be off to do too much. And as a result, you're getting huge sums of money paid for midfielders that are, I think, more all-round talents than, like, real sort of genius edge of your seat midfielders. Or, you know, the sort of central midfielders that you would think would define Premier League eras. So, you know, Vieira or Skoles or Keen or Cante or De Bruyne are kind of more recent vintage. I don't think any of the midfielders that we've seen changing, you know, for that much money. For that much money. No, in that bracket. I think rice might, I think rice might, the way rice sort of runs a game and the way he, I was just watching quite close to yesterday and just like the way he moves with the ball as well. I think he, if there is one in this area, it could be him. I think rice is about as close as you get in the Premier League and maybe kaisedo as well on a good day. But if you actually look at the great central midfielders, they're all playing out, you know, out of the Premier League. The team here, Drew Bellingham, you know, Vettifal Verdi, and I think that is, I get a product of the pace and physicality of the Premier League is played out. And I think it's also a reason why we should all hope that Florian Vietz has a good season. Baz, did you think either keeper should have done better for either opening goal or that sometimes the ball is just right in the corner and that's okay? I think Maritinez will be very disappointed if you can save the Kai Haveris shot. And no, I thought the Morgan Rodgers won. Without wanting to take away from Rodgers, it was a bit of a shinner, wasn't it? Yeah. That went right in the corner. I wouldn't blame the keeper for that. I did notice that a lot of people seem to think Gabrielle should have been sent off for booting, Emmy Maritinez in the head. And now I'm going to do something I don't do very often and stick up for Gabrielle because I think it was a total accident which was that worse careless. So it probably should have been a foul, but it wasn't reckless and it wasn't, which would be yellow and he didn't use excessive force which being a red. So I think he shouldn't have been sent off. Other people, a lot of other opinions are available. Of course. And just on, just on Chelsea, because Cold Palmer started the season really well. Him and Rodgers scored so early, Jordan. So you think, okay, you know, this is a huge moment but they didn't quite click. You can see it's there, right? Especially with Pedro. There was one move. I think Pedro played a beautiful reverse pass to Netto, I think. But the, I don't know. I think there's real positivity there even though you didn't quite see it yesterday. No, I agree. I thought Pedro was really good actually. I think he's a really sensitive forward. I really like him. I think his hold up play is impressive. I think, again, he drives the ball for someone so big. Really well. But Pop Palmer didn't have his best game. I think he kind of flitted in and out of the game with some cute moments with that really impacting the game too much. But I think that their performance up top is going to be predicated going back to the future about how good the midfield behind them is because they're not the sort of players that are going to do much going the other way. So they need a midfield base to kind of be solid to platform what they can do really well. But I've no doubt that Shabby Lonzer will have them plays some really good football and affecting games in a better way than they did yesterday. Two, the Hill Dickinson then, Everton Two, Manchester United Two. Now, I was watching a very low grade game of cricket on a bench in London fields yesterday. But there was the pub on the park. I could hear the cheers and I was trying to work out, you know, who'd scored when. But I hadn't, there's no way from my bench, Barry, that I would have predicted Ainsley-Mateland Niles going that gut. I mean, what an unbelievable goal it is. I watched this so many times. I thought that must be a deflection. Like there's something, but just the whip. It's sort of Andy Gray, you know, what a hit son, look at the bend on that ball. It's just amazing. Yeah, I mean, I saw what happened in real time and I wasn't convinced I... It had happened. And I was aware that Ainsley-Mateland Niles was at Everton and when he's, they signed him on Deadline Day, I was like, where's he been? And so, yeah, he's been in Leon for the last three seasons. It turns out this was the second Premier League goal ever, his first in eight years. And what a goal, what an introduction to his new fan base. It was an incredible shot after good work by Jack Relish and Hayden Hackney. I'm not sure who teed the ball up from, but it was some strike and just curling away from the keeper into the top in unsavable, I think. And the thing is with Ainsley-Mateland Niles, I was aware of his existence when he was at Aristotle, but I can't really remember anything significantly done. But I thought he was like a wavy, winger type. And then I see this big bulky guy coming off the bench for Everton and, oh, that's Ainsley-Mateland Niles. So, I kind of forgotten about him. See also Ben Chilwell, who also popped up with the goal this season, or this weekend. So, yeah, I mean, I think Manchester United will obviously be gutted to lose to last minute goal and especially one like that. But Tariq George is open or for Everton as well. He was fantastic, like, what a strike from a really tight angle. And I don't think, you know, goalkeepers get criticized for being beaten at the New York Post. I don't think there was any stuff in there. I always call those finishes a real power league goal. That's a real power league goal for Tariq George. Just like one touch to set yourself, one touch to twat it. Yeah, I agree with you. Whereas the main, the mate of Niles isn't a power league goal. It's, when you watch it, it's just a side foot pass. I don't bang on about this being the greatest skill in football, but to get that much power and that much precision. And afterwards, I think they were the match to the day commentator was like, you know, is that your best goal ever? He was like, well, you could say that. And now Barry, I mean, I'd like to see his other goal. If, you know, if it's up there. I've got a friend, an Arsenal fan, a friend of mine who wasn't the biggest fan of him when he was at Arsenal. It's a great aim at all. And he was so, he was so cruel. He said to me yesterday, yeah, it's a great goal, but I think it's going for the other corner to try and insinuate that actually he's that bad. He wasn't actually going for the corner but he went for it. I just thought it was really mean, really cruel of his being. And now I've seen it again. I can't unsee the fact that maybe he was aiming for the other one, but he probably wasn't. You know, I suppose when you try and bend a ball like that, you are more likely trying to bend it into the top right than the top left. I can remember Beckham doing a few sort of top left from there with your right foot. Oh, such a brilliant moment. I mean, it was a really good game. I thought the second half, especially it was great. It was a good game. United fans will be, will be gutted about, you know, not seeing that match out. It was a good game for someone like me, the neutral had no investment in it. Some great goals in there, but I think for a man United's point of view, it's another game where you have to really question how much they can dig in and see these sorts of games out. No, we don't know where you're going to finish this season, but you think an evident team that didn't get the players in that they wanted in this summer window and there's a little bit animosity between the fans and the club about that. You'd have thought United could have gone there and taken advantage of that and really kind of got out of there with three points, but to kind of, you know, be ahead and give it away so late. Otherwise, really poor for Manchester United, really, really poor of them. And I'm not saying there's questions of Michael Carrick, but I think there was some weird decisions, substitutions and tactics wise in this match that if I was a United fan, I think. Like what? I don't understand the dog who think for me. I know he won the ball back for the second goal I think it was, but I think where he deploys dog, I don't rate dog with it, where he deploys him. I just think it's really, really odd and I think it unsettles, unsettles a team. I thought Rashad had a really good game. I don't know why he came off. That was really weird to me. He was probably the one attacking player that I thought was causing problems and he's done that a couple of times and now taking off players when they're playing well. The back four, the changes to the back four just thought were odd as well. And I thought it unnecessary disturbed what I thought was at that point a solid way performance from United. Would you make it, Johnny? I thought maybe Carrick was caught a little bit in between two stores in terms of, do you go for the second goal or do you try and lock down that game? I don't think he really committed to either strategy and I think you could sense that sort of indecision in the way they approached the final minutes. And in contrast, more is his substitutions worked really well. He doesn't have many players left but the ones that he deployed, he deployed well, three Lish came on and did really well, obviously Makeland Niles and Hayden Hackney came on as well. He, I think he laid on Tyrick George's goal. And I think for Everton, it's like after the week that they've had, I could have a farcical week, really humiliating week for a lot of fans. I think a lot of fans will say they feel kind of humiliated by the Balagan stuff and how all of that finished. And to have that week end on that moment with a really lovely moment for a player who wouldn't have been at the club if Everton had been able to sign Kenny Tete from Fullham. That's kind of, you know, it's been a bit, a bit absurd. Would Tete have put it in the other corner? That's the question. Tete would have put it in the right corner, at least. Yeah. I mean, we should mention Bumo's goal was brilliant and there was an amazing tackle from Tarkovsky on Kunia, which I reckon somewhere else on the pitch barry they might give a foul. I don't know, like it comes from behind, but it is brilliant. It's sort of, there's no way can you can't score until this enormous leg appears. Yeah, Mark Sraschford would have been on the ball running towards his byline. He ran out of the road, so rolled it back into Kunia's part. He had an empty net to stroke into from close range. And Tarkovsky came in from behind, but he won the ball completely, cleanly. I guess it was his momentum that brought Kunia down. I think that would be very harsh to give a penalty for that. I don't think it was a foul. It was a brilliant bit of improvisation by Rashford, actually. I mean, that was the moment, actually, more than any other thought, okay, he's on it this season. Yeah. All right, that'll do for part one, part two. We'll begin at Craven Cottage. The Guardian Football Weekly Wednesday night. Thank you, everyone, who came to Dublin. We had a nice time, Barry, didn't we? We did indeed, just thank you, everyone. Thank you, Dublin. And we're going to do the same again on Wednesday at the Soho Theatre in Walton, Stowe. Johnny is going to be there, along with Nicki Bandini and Foods, Mark Langdon. There are a few tickets still remaining. Go to the Guardian.co.uk slash football weekly live. It would be lovely to see you. And we're live streaming it. If you are not in or near Walton, Stowe, you still have absolutely no excuse. Unless I guess you came to the Dublin show, then I think it's okay if you don't live streaming. Not saying they'll be the same, of course, different panel, different stuff. But yeah, Guardian.co.uk slash football weekly live. We're lovely to see you. Full of two, Crystal Palace three. I mean, if Tyrick George scored the best goal for a Tyrick this weekend, then I think Tyrick Mitchell scored the worst, Baz. Wow, I loved his second goal so much. I still don't know what happened. And I don't think he did. But I've just delighted that goals like that can be scored in the Premier League. Yeah, well, I mean, he had pre-emptage, his name-sakes goal with a near-post surface to wear a rasp or yet to equalize for Palace. And then his second one, it was very weird. He sort of advanced with the ball, had took a shot. His shot was blocked across the area, but only half cleared as far as him again. And the ball basically clanked off his standing leg, I think, was rolling various trundling towards the line, at which point Gonzalo Garcia swung a mighty boot at it to hack it clear, but just completely missed the ball. And then watched in horror as it sort of wiped its feet and then crossed the line almost apologetically. It was a fine ball. This game was bonkers, it was really good. And it was also massively enhanced by some hideously bad defending by both teams. I think four of the five goals were very, very avoidable. There seemed to be a lot of ricochets, scrambles, deflections, partners, but a great game, full and remain winless and they've got Liverpool away next and man United at home after that. Yeah, a tough start to the season for them. After that, they played the three promoted sides, but at least two of whom are showing signs of a lot of life. Yeah, yeah, actually coveshine, showing a bit of life. I mean, I guess, Johnny, how soon do you get worried about having no points? Is three games not enough games to worry about having no points if you're full of them? No, I mean, especially the way the fixtures turn after the international break. But if I, I mean, a lot of full fans are worried. I mean, they are worried about, about our blower. You know, after the Chelsea game, he said, we didn't deserve to lose this game. After the Sunderland defeat, he said, it was a tough game for us, we didn't deserve it. And after this game, he said, we didn't deserve to lose this game. And I think full of them, it's bad news for full of them. They appear to have signed the world's unluckiest manager. It just keeps getting beaten undeservedly. There is obviously a lot of promise there. You can see what body's trying to do, but they just need to tighten up. New signings look good. But you know, that second goal, which obviously ends in a farcical fashion. But also like where the hell is that? New Robinson-wise, Garcia having to sprint back 80 yards to his own goal to try and clear the ball. Where is the structure there? So yeah, obviously, it's a team that's betting in and it's a coach that's adapting to the league. But at the moment, it's very good news for the neutral and very bad news for the Spanish-Ryland. This was a bad one, I thought, for full of them, because from what I hear from those football fans and journalists of the teams that win the Premier League last season, full of them, Palace and Sunderland, are the three teams I hear likely, if people think I'm likely to go down, if it's not the three that came up, and for full of them to lose to Palace at home, that was a bad one. And I agree with Johnny, I think the excuse is and the rhetoric coming out of Arbeloa, that kind of worries me needs to kind of stop now, because the three teams that came up all look okay and in the case of how they've got points on the board in a big way, so full of them need to really fix up quickly. They could have got a point here. The Rugby and Gomune's had two good chances, right at the end. Point wouldn't have been on failure. They're still 12th for me. I reckon they're still 12th. I think they're five. And you mentioned it, Bazz, but it's such a, it is a great moment for Ben Chilwell, right? We were talking about Maiden Lars, but at one point, he was sort of heir apparent for the England, he was the England death back, or at least competing with Luke Shaw. Was it him and Luke Shaw at the same time and got bad injury, sort of career-stalled a bit. Who knows how well who got Palace, but that must be a real moment for when you are just, when you haven't had a great time for a while, still a winner in a three-two ding-dong. I mean, he'd been a Palace before, obviously, when he was out of favor at Chelsea, and then he's like me, the Niles, I guess, kind of the forgotten man, so he arrives back and announces himself by scoring with his, I think it was his first touch after coming off the bench, so yeah, fair play to him. It was just no Liverpool, too. I Jordan, a huge three minutes, for Alexander Isaac here. Yes, massive, yeah. He needed this, he really needed this, because he didn't have the best of seasons last year, and obviously had that lead break, that could tell this season, but he needed to just kind of flex again, and show, remind the league, that I am still the Premier, Strayac and his league. A lot of people talking, as I mentioned, they only run about Pedro, Jal Pedro, Chelsea being like the best Strayac and the league off the Holland. I think it's clearly Isaac, and I think this, to showcase that he's still an elite player. I think the finish is a really good, as well, from him, in this game, but can I just quick a quick point about the Floring Verts, because I don't think you'll be a Liverpool next season. I think he's massively struggling. He's doing that thing. People talk about the best creative players in the world, and in history, that they, when they're playing, the game stops, and time stands still, and they really have the game played at their tempo. When I watch him play, and I'm a big fan of his, by the way, I feel like he's doing the opposite, he's rushing, and I think he's so conscious that the tempo, and the speed and the pace of the Premier League, is so different to Germany. He gets to ball, and I think he's rushing so quickly, and I don't know if he'll be able to get over that. I think he's not, I think he's really struggling to really get used to the tempo of this league, and I can see Liverpool cutting their losses in the summer, and moving. When I think he's a brilliant player, but there's other players have come to this league in the past that I just feel the Premier League isn't forward. I think he could be, I think he could be not long for this league. I agree with you on ESEC, especially the way he took his second goal, but the pass, Barry, from Gakpo. Gakpo, who was sort of seemed to be surplus to requirements, but is turning out to be Liverpool's best player at the moment. I think the Liverpool fans, they were getting very frustrated with the last season. I wouldn't have been particularly sorry to see him go if he had been sold in the window, but he started the season exceptionally well, and the two passes for both goals were brilliant. The second one, in particular, was lovely. I mean, he had a bit of help from the Ipswich set up, leaving so much space in behind for Isaac to run into, but yeah, he's had a great start to the season. Yeah, I'm not quite sure what Chirpin and the Ipswich goal was doing for the second goal, but he's actually had a lot of work to do. What have you made of Liverpool so far, Johnny? I think we've seen from the opening gaming as Newcastle progression in terms of performances and progression in terms of the understandings that they were developing. We saw glimpses of the relationship between Isaac and Vierce that we were seeing in preseason, and then Newcastle just seemed like last season's Liverpool all over again, but we are seeing a progression from Mireola. And Isaac scoring Newcastle-type goals, that first finish, that was the sort of goal he was banging in a Newcastle with regularity, like not even half chances, quarter chances, a lot of them, and really emphatically as well. And also, I think encouraging that Mireola is happy to keep rotating his minutes, their minutes. So Isaac comes off about 60 minutes, Barclay comes on, who I think is a good signing, he looks very bright. And Munoz, I think, has started the season quite well. As we all know, it's just what happens when they get counted. It's what happens when a team can just run straight through the middle of them. That is going to be the thing that Mireola needs to fix. At Man City, a top of the league, Baz, I mean, Coventry had some chances in this game, and Donna Rummer had a sort of really odd game where he was made some brilliant sides, but also looked absolutely terrible at the same time. Yeah, well, he almost gifted an alternate Coventry when he first touched of a street mugger when Cushionov sent a fairly straightforward back pass his way, very nearly let it roll over the line, but hacked it clear just before it did. I thought Coventry were extremely unlucky not to take anything from this game. They had four big, big chances, and we're almost gifted that comedy on goal. It was an excellent performance from them. And it took a really, really good Man City goal to beat them. So I know Coventry have not, they haven't scored yet, and they haven't got a point yet, but if I was a commentary fan, I'd be delighted with that performance. Sorry, I know you asked me about Donna Rummer. No, no, no, no, that's actually where I meandered. No, no, no, it was the right place to go, because I mean, I want to have such a massive chance, Jordan, doesn't he? And then the Rodoni, how Donna Rummer saves the chance from Rodoni, I don't know. But yeah, if you're Corve, you're just there going, you know it's a free hit, but unlike the Arsenal game, it's a free hit and you lose comfortably, okay, fair enough. This is a free hit where you go, actually, as the game progressing, it's a hit. It's not a free hit, it's just a hit hit, or whatever it is, you know? A one he's got to score that chance for me. I mean, I actually really like him. He's not the best sense forward in the world. He's got limitations, but I actually thought it was a good signing from Nine of Forest. And I wonder, Vardy's just gone to Burnley, and I wonder if Vardy was worth a punt for Coventry, who knows how good Vardy is? This is true, this is true. But no, I think they should take something away from the performance, but they've got to get some points in the board really soon, because, you know, as I mentioned, Hull are up and running in a big way. And if Switch lost, yes, on Friday, but they look good, yeah, before you know it, they could be a drift. They've got Brighton next, so they'll be looking at that game as to get to get their first points in the board. Yeah, actually, they've got what Brighton, Forest, Newcastle, Tottenham, Fullham, Sunderland. I mean, they could lose all of them, right? But, you know, that's not like a terrifying set of fixtures, I think, on your media, if Burnley were going to take a chance on a top podcast or with a short-term contract, she'd gone from me, really. Or Mike Dean, of course. I thought I could have done with this, do with the season of Championship Weedges. Oh, I'd love to see you and Ashley Barnes up front together. Is he still there? That would be wonderful. Another flick on from Barnes and Glendending latches on to it and puts it away. It's Stone Hill, Burnley 3. Where does Enzo fit on your mediocre midfield list, Johnny? Or what have you made? He got the pre-assist assist, I think, if we're counting them. I don't even know how many passes before this. It was good ball down the line. He wasn't going to play it to start, but I think it was a Riley got injured in the warm-up. So we have to caveat it with, he may be still not 100 per cent fit. I'll find it baffling that Enzo Fernandez is the first player to come on to 100 million pound trot for fees. He's all right, he does a lot of the simple things well. And City do have an absolute wealth of options in the center of the pitch now. You actually do wonder where Foden fits into this now with Cherokee and Enzo Fernandez and Buaddi coming in and Undi and there was a real wealth of talent to bed in there. But I might, I might the only one who's expecting a little bit more from City, like four shots on target against Coventry. They've, yes, they're 100 per cent. Yes, it's a team in transition, but also they haven't really played anyone that good yet. Palace and Bournemouth haven't obviously been able to strengthen from this summer because of the UEFA's SCR rules through an European competition this season. And Porto, who they play, is it tomorrow night? I think in the Champions League, I've started the season really well. And it would not surprise me if Porto turned City over. That's interesting. I mean, it's simultaneously sign of a good side if you're winning games when you're not playing well. And then Liverpool, who won five in a row at the start of last season and then actually weren't a good team and they weren't playing well. You can be a team who aren't very good and not play well. I mean, that is evidently possible. Elliot Anderson made 155 passes in the game. That seems a lot, doesn't it? Is that real? That's so many. Sort of like constantly, just constantly passing the ball. Anyway, St James's point, you can't still two ball with two. This would have found my buzz, isn't it? Yeah, I really enjoyed this one. Bournemouth rolled out of the traps in this one. They were by far the better team in the first half and should have been home and holds by half time, really, I think, but Newcastle managed to turn it around after going two nil down. Yeah, I mean, the goal is a game from Harvey Barnes kept them in it. And then Jacob Ramsey scored a lay equalizer after Bournemouth had repeatedly failed to clear across from the right. Bournemouth now dropped seven points from winning positions. They've conceded goals in the 84th minute, the 91st minute, twice in the 88th minute. So that's something that needs to be addressed. And it was put to Marco Rose afterwards and he said, yeah. And but the more we address it, the more it becomes ingrained and it becomes a recurring thing. So yeah, but it is something that needs to be addressed these late lapses in concentration. Newcastle have now faced 59 shots in three games, which seems to be a lot of shots, 20 game, pretty much. But I think they were lucky to stay in the game because between Bournemouth's two goals, Evan Eels and Mr. Glorious Chance. So they could have been three up, they could have been even further ahead, I think. But yeah, Newcastle did well to rescue a point. Tavineer is slightly catching my eye. And back in the last part of last season, I was watching a bit of him and this season, I think he started really well too. But Alex Scott is just one of my favorite players in the Premier League and we did the Premier League preview few weeks ago and he was my rogue shot for player of the year. And I just love watching him play and I think there's definitely a big move. I think he's a midfielder that actually would be worth to Johnny's article about midfielder's going for big money. I think one of the few midfielder's actually would be worth a figure of that for you. I think he's a crazy talent and I think he would really elevate most midfielder's in the Premier League. But I was also wondering to myself, what is the weirdest goal of the weekend that the Tyreek Mitchell goal or the Alex Scott deflected one that went over and looped? I've seen loopy ones many times. You don't see often just a ball going in so slowly. Like, I don't know when the, you know, it hit his leg in like the 27th minute and went in in like the 31st minute. Like that, that for me, that was special. Yeah, Alex Scott can do everything. He's caught quite a generic face and a generic name and I reckon that might count against him, you know? As someone with a generic face, I, you know, it's definitely count against me despite my intense, immense talent of doing everything, you know, I think Alex got. He's from Gernsey, that's his thing is that he's from Gernsey. Okay. Was Lassau from Gernsey or Jersey? Was, you see there are... Lassau was from Jersey, the TCA was from Gernsey. Yeah, okay, right. And then he from Aldenny, have they produced anyone yet? Probably not. Forgotten Channel Island. Anyway, that'll do for part two, part three. We'll go through all the other draws in the Premier League. Welcome to part three of the Guardian Football Weekly, Brentford won Sunderland won. I mean, Barry Sunderland, you were at, like, I just, there were so many moments we were like, well, that has to have gone in and it hadn't. And you know, this sort of, like, peerless, unbeatable Brentford side, you made them look absolutely hopeless for 45 minutes. Sunderland were brilliant and to not win this game is a travesty. Yeah, I don't think I've ever seen Sunderland play as well as they did in the first half of this game. Now, I mean, the bar is quite low. I will concede, but they were astonishingly good. Just so good going forward. And Brentford had no real answers for them. They had a goal, disallowed, fair enough, I think Dan Ballard scored a look with a low shot, but Kevin Dansell was standing in front of a quevenkeller in an offside position. I don't think Keller would have got near the ball anyway, but Dems the Ruse, so that's fair enough. Enzo La Faye smashed a shot off the poles. Thomas Munier had a shot blocked on the line by Yannick Schuster. Sunderland monstered Brentford in the first half. And so, of course, it came to pass. They went behind, but they managed to salvage an equalizer with a penalty from Enzo La Faye, who I think I love watching him play, he's a great player. So they should have won. Got a point away that it's all right, but they were so good though. Yeah, I still think this, if the keeper's not going to get it, it's good to see Kevin Dansell doing everything he can as an expert player to make sure a goal isn't scored. It was time I'm gone that attempt for no goals at all from anyone this season, but I just think, you know, the keeper's not getting it. So I'm happy for other people to be to think it's fair. There were more contentious disallowed goals. Yes, we'll get to that. Should we get to that, though? Where are the city ground? I mean, the story is Nico Williams. The story here is Nico Williams' handball or not handball. Williams himself said VAR was guessing. The still image looks like he's catching it, but still images don't always tell the story. I mean, I don't know what you think, Jordan. Does look like it hits his wrist, I think. It does. I mean, I could be once again on my own here, but I don't see the debate. The correct decision was made. It had to be disallowed. It feels unlucky. It feels unlucky, even if it should be disallowed. That's exactly what it is. It is unlucky, but it's the right decision ultimately. So I didn't have a massive issue with the final call on this one. It feels particularly unlucky that Harry McGuire, last weekend, got given his goal even though he handballed it because the ball, like his shot, was actually going wide. And so it technically counted as an own goal. So Harry McGuire gets to keep his goal after handballing it on the basis of his own shit shot, which I think is, I think that's an unfairness in the rules. Sure. So if Nick O'Williams had sort of headed it, bundled it with his hand, but wide, which would have been quite impressive from that distance, more impressive. Tanali who, Lord knows what he was doing, I'd managed to then hook it in. He would have counted as a goal. I mean, no goal so far this season for Tottenham, no shots on target in this game, Johnny. Do you think they should score a goal soon? Yeah, I mean, they, I think it would be a very good idea. It's like, what Gandhi said about Western civilization. I think it would be a very good idea. They, you know, there was, there was a problem, I think, in that you can't just keep tossing away the guys who have scored goals for you in the past in previous seasons. And obviously for good rational reasons, without, you know, feeling that at some point, you know, Varsalisin has gone, you know, son, Brennan Johnson, a Kulesiewski Madison injured, Slanky injured, Romero got, Romero is one of their top scorers for the last, for the last two or three seasons. And you, you can't take all of those goals out of the team without replacing them with something. And that, that something at the moment is a number nine in, you know, Mahmouj, who we're not even sure actually is a number nine. You know, at city, at Frankfurt as well, he played a much sort of more nuanced, kind of sort of hybrid wide, wide attacker coming into central areas sort of sort of role. So I think that is something that deserving still has to work out. As long as, as well as all the other stuff, he has to work out. But I think these things become, they become hardwired after a while. I think, you know, teams forget how to score a goal. And when, when teams are humming, it almost, the goal is almost kind of incidental because the processes are working so well. Tottenham almost kind of have to wheel a goal out of something. I think it will come because they have enough talents to do it, but it's kind of worried at the moment. You know, was that Mahmouj Saviotel, Kudus, Midrick and Selanki, Baz, unless I've forgotten anyone. How many goals are there? None of the moment. They're going to score goals. They're a football team. Are they? Are they very expensively assembled for football team? They will score goals at some point. This is one prediction. I would be really happy to get wrong if Spurs can go an entire Premier League season without scoring a single goal. It's the opposite of the invincible, I was just going to say it's invincible, isn't it? It's just the totally invincible. Yeah, lots of questions about the midfield as well. Tynali hasn't done anything yet, apart from contriving to help Niko Williams score that goal. That was just bad. For us without a win so far as well, Jordan, and they didn't, Spurs were probably better than them in this game as well, which might be a worry for Glasgow. They look good at Liverpool, but not here. No, I think for us will be fine this season. I think Spurs over the course of this game were just about the better team, and if you had to make a call on who deserved to get the three points, I think you would probably lean towards Spurs. But I think for us will be okay, and I saw enough from Forrest in this game and the previous game to think that they're going to be fine. And I rate Glasgow, I think it's a really good manager, and I think once he gets his hands on that team, I think there's a mid-table finish for them at the bare minimum. Hall-Nill, Villanill, not a classic, but a whole star. It's brilliant. You know, just at the end, there was that ball whipped into the box, but Bernie took it off someone else's feet, didn't they? They could have got all three points in it. They could have, I think they should have, actually. You know, we all predicted that Hall-Nill would get off to this great star to the season. LAUGHTER And they're doing us proud. I have to say, I think they probably had the better chances in what wasn't a very good game, but Moe Ballumi, he had an amazing effort that came off the bar, whipped shot from a really tight angle. Ali McBerney's chances, he said, Chow had a really good chance. And Emmy Bendy probably missed Villas' best chances, shanked one over the bar when scoring looked easier, but Villas' season is off to the poor start, similarly poor to last season, not scoring goals, not winning games. Hall are surprising everyone, and looked they'll be delighted to have seven points after three games, but it could be nine. And I think it possibly should have been nine. But they're, you know, it's far too early to predict what's going to happen to them, but the early signs and statistics of previous teams who have acquired seven or more points after three games suggest they will be fine, which is a worry for other teams who are going to be circling the drain. They're probably presumed they will go straight back down like everyone else did in giving me. Yeah, I think their manager's like, you know, he hasn't really well set up. Do you think has some Villarol score a goal this season? Um, I hope they don't, but I think what was interesting was that they had Tammy Abraham on the bench. Yeah, I think started on the bench. I think Tammy Abraham's is the best record they've got, so they are going to strike the score a goal. I don't understand why they're not, they're not playing him more. Maybe it's a fitness thing, but I think the problem is that you know, I'm really just doesn't like Tammy Abraham's doesn't rate him. He wanted to get rid of him during the window, but Abraham refused to go. And there was one, probably one of the highlights of this game was when you know, I'm really through an absolute shit fit on the sideline because he was trying to bring on Abraham and Aaron, one basaka and neither of them were ready. And I saw a writer on football 365 flagged up the fact that Alejandro Garinatio was sitting on the villa bench wearing like six or seven earrings. So that doesn't smack of a player whose head is in the game and ready to come on if required. Uh, bright one leads one. What do you make of this, Jordan? Good game. I like leads. I mean, I've got lead having a really good season. I like watching leads. They're, they're my fun team to watch. There's so much energy, so much pace. They run like hell for Daniel Farcon. And that, that always makes for entertaining watching whenever I do see leads. Um, I think there'll be a bit annoyed. They didn't take all three points here. I, I think they, they will be regretting that they, they, they let this one go. Um, but they're, yeah, they're definitely my fun team to watch. They can't win at the amics. They've, they've been to the amics 11 times and never won. Which it's, so I, I was at the game. The last time leads one at Brighton and it was at the with Dean. It was 2009. It was one of the first games I ever covered as a reporter. And, and it was at the with these, like, the athletics, the old athletics track just outside Brighton where there were, there were, there were six stands. And the leads fans were all, they, they put them on a temporary stand. It was driving rain. Actually, piston down and the leads fans were having to watch this game through the discus cage. Uh, anyone who worked at the with Dean. It was a very, it was a place with lots and lots of character. Uh, and all was almost got a suited leads. And it, but that was back in league one. That was a league one game. Robert Snodgrass, Jermaine Beckford and Neil Kilkenny. Of course. Of course. Yes. There they are. It was all done by half time, as I remember. Yeah, two and a half and done. Yeah. For a cup reporter. Barry, well, we wondered about the sort of Mike Dean story and how big a store and giving him oxygen or addressing this thing which might be quite serious. Um, he went on a podcast who was here. Was this the Jamie Vardy? Jamie Vardy's podcast. Jamie Vardy and Mike Dean having a party. And on this, Mike Dean said that he used to try and not see how long he'd go without leaving the center circle, like every amateur ref I've ever played. Yeah. They've been doing that game for years. Uh, at least he didn't sit in his car and use it. Yeah. He didn't get in the case for us to, um, which way the ball was, his decisions were going. And then he tried to do see how long he'd go with that blowing the whistle in games. And the real saddest is for them, people who've had to go and watch every Mike Dean game. To see him or see him or see a football podcasts. Yeah. This is like, um, no. Now I've got to watch every Mike Dean game. There was a game against West Brom where he didn't blow the whistle around 19 minutes. I don't know what a source of think. What are you doing, Mike? Either doing it is stupid or saying it is stupid or both is stupid. I said it years ago. I think he just wants to be on strictly, but anyway. Yeah, uh, when it came out first, I assumed he was bullshitting just to impress the bigger boys who we interviewing him. A lot of people seem to share my view. But then, as you say, evidence was uncovered that he did play at least one game where he didn't blow the whistle for almost 20 minutes. But Dale Johnson said, yeah, I've watched that game. And to be honest, he didn't really have any reason to blow his whistle for the first 19 minutes. So I'm paraphrasing there. So I don't know what to make of it. If he was at that crack, it's very unprofessional. He can be punished retrospectively if he is found to have been acting on professionally or bringing the game into disrepute. What he's really not doing is the current crop of referees, any favors, because there are a lot of people out there in social media land who are convinced referees are corrupt. I don't think that's the case. I think it's a really tough job. And almost all of them are doing their very best under very difficult circumstances. But stupid comments like that from him don't help. I just get, I want to be loved vibes. I want to be in the, I want to be with the cool kids vibe. I want to be attention. I just, I've always just thought this guy to someone that is not particularly liked and he will say what everything to say to get attention and to, to seem cool and funny. He's like, even if he did do this, why would you feel the need to say that? Even the podcast is just, and I think the more serious part is what Barry says is, I think it's just now putting so much more pressure on current referees. It's just like, just be quiet. Just because you've retired and got your Christy job at Sky, think about the people that are still doing the job that now are going to be under more pressure because of what you've been, what you've been saying. I watched the whole interview rather than just the pertinent bits about his many games within games. And one thing he did say in the interview which has gone unremarked upon is they asked him if when he was a referee he ever had it in for certain players and he said yes, which I think that's equally alarming. And now I suppose it's human nature if, you know, if certain players are constantly on your back, you are going to have it in for them but to admit it is, is quite alarming. And the thing is, when he was saying this, Sephardi and Josh, Josh and Jamie, they didn't dig into it. They didn't ask him for examples or like I suspect, you know, a more experienced journalist or TV presenter or radio host might have. So they just seemed a bit surprised and then moved on to the next topic. Does he come across, because sometimes you easily clip and you got something but when you see a whole thing, they actually come across much more human or not. I very much got the vibe, you know, I don't have much of interest to say but I'm trying to big myself up to impress these guys. That's the vibe I got. It's the whole referee vibe. I mean, no kid dreams are becoming a referee. How many of them are doing it? Out of the sheer love of refereeing. I mean, obviously there's an element of proximity to this incredibly, incredible orb of fame and attention. I think that is clearly why a lot of referees do it. And not to tarnish the whole profession, which I guess I am doing. But there is always an element of that with referees. You know, they do want to be at the center of things a lot of the time. Okay, that'll do for today. We're back on Wednesday and Friday to go through a return of the Champions League. And we'll see you on Wednesday night, of course, at the Soho Theatre, John Walton Stowe, come along. If you and I don't have any tickets left, you and a hundred friends want to come. That would be great. Guardian.co.uk, such football weekly live. WSL is back. We've got all that covered on women's football weekly, fake brothers. Your host for that one. But thank you, everybody. Thank you, Jordan. Cheers, mate. Thank you, Johnny. Thanks, Max. Cheers, Baz. Thank you. Football Weekly is produced by James Pike, Watson and Tyre Papula. Our executive producer is Joel Grove back on Wednesday. This is The Guardian.